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Using Cortisol & Adrenaline to Boost Our Energy & Immune System Function | Huberman Lab Podcast #18



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Welcome to the Huberman Lab Podcast,
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where we discuss science and science-based tools
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for everyday life.
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I'm Andrew Huberman, and I'm a professor of neurobiology
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and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine.
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This podcast is separate from my teaching
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and research roles at Stanford.
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It is, however, part of my desire and effort
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to bring zero cost to consumer information
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about science and science-related tools
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to the general public.
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In keeping with that theme,
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I'd like to thank the sponsors of today's podcast.
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Our first sponsor is Inside Tracker.
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Inside Tracker is a personalized nutrition platform
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that analyzes data from your blood and DNA
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to help you better understand your body
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and reach your health goals.
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I've long been a fan of doing blood tests,
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and more recently as they've been developed,
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also DNA tests.
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And the reason for that is that so many of the factors
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that impact our immediate and long-term health
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and that inform our health choices
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can only be analyzed by way of blood or DNA tests.
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The great thing about Inside Tracker
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is they make getting the blood and DNA tests extremely easy.
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They'll come to your home if you like,
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or you can go to a place where you can get your blood drawn
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and your DNA swab taken there.
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As well, once you get the information back
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from Inside Tracker, it's very easy to understand
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what to do with that information, how to interpret it.
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And that's really what sets Inside Tracker apart, I believe,
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from other blood and DNA testing tools and companies.
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Most sources and companies will give you information back
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about what your levels of hormones are
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and metabolic factors, et cetera,
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but no clear directives about what to do
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with that information to get those markers
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in the ranges that you want
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in order to optimize your health.
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Inside Tracker makes that all very easy.
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It gives you directives about exercise, about nutrition,
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about various supplements you may or may not want to take.
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And once again, only through blood and DNA tests
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can you access that information.
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If you want to try Inside Tracker,
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you can visit insidetracker.com slash Huberman.
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And if you do that,
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you'll get 25% off any of Inside Tracker's plans.
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That's insidetracker.com slash Huberman
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to get 25% off and enter Huberman at checkout.
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Today's episode is also brought to us by Athletic Greens.
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Athletic Greens is an all-in-one
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vitamin mineral probiotic drink.
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I've been taking Athletic Greens since 2012,
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and so I'm delighted that they're sponsoring the podcast.
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00:02:25.060
I started taking Athletic Greens
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and I still take Athletic Greens once or twice a day
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because it covers all my nutritional vitamin mineral
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and probiotic bases.
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Of course, you can get vitamins and minerals
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and probiotics from food,
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but many of us, including me,
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find it hard to do that on a consistent basis,
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especially when I'm working a lot,
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when stress and sleep aren't optimized, et cetera.
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With Athletic Greens,
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I make sure to get all the things I need,
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and then all the other supplements I take or what I eat,
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I can consider additional insurance.
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The great thing about Athletic Greens is it tastes great.
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I like to mix mine with water
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and a little bit of lemon juice.
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I take it once early in the day
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and then sometimes again in the afternoon.
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The fact that it includes probiotics
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is really important to me.
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There are so many data now pointing to the fact
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that probiotics and gut brain health
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and gut health generally are very important for metabolism,
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for hormone output, for neurotransmitter production,
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so many vital things related to our health.
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Athletic Greens makes it easy to make sure
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that I'm getting everything that I need
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in the vitamin mineral and probiotic department.
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If you'd like to try Athletic Greens,
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you can go to athleticgreens.com slash Huberman
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and claim a special offer.
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They'll give you five free travel packs
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plus a year supply of vitamin D3K2.
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There's now a ton of data as well pointing to the fact
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that vitamin D3 and K2 are important for a huge number
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of health related factors, including hormones,
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metabolic factors, neurotransmitters, et cetera.
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So they have the year supply of vitamin D3 completely free
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along with your Athletic Greens offer
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and you get the five free travel packs.
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So if you'd like to try that,
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you go to athleticgreens.com slash Huberman
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and claim the special offer.
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00:04:05.540
Today's episode is also brought to us by Headspace.
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Headspace is a meditation app that makes meditation easy.
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I started meditating many years ago,
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but I found it was difficult to stay consistent
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with my meditation practice.
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In fact, when I would get stressed or really busy,
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that's when I probably needed
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the meditation practice the most.
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And that's when I tended to drop the meditation practice
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and run around doing other things.
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So it was really a kind of catch 22.
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I learned about Headspace a few years ago
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on JetBlue flights when they had them included
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as an option of whether or not to watch a movie
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or a television show or do meditation.
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I tried the meditation and I really liked it.
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Very easy to follow along with a Headspace meditation.
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The meditations that they include on the Headspace app
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are also backed by dozens of peer reviewed
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quality independent studies.
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And of course there are now thousands
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of peer reviewed quality studies pointing to the fact
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that a meditation practice is beneficial
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for sake of improved sleep, for reducing stress
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and a number of other health metrics,
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cardiovascular disease, risk, et cetera.
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The great thing about Headspace is it's allowed me
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to stay really consistent with my meditation practice.
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They have meditations of different duration
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and different type.
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So you never get bored.
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I actually look forward to my meditation practice
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and it continues to benefit me.
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In fact, since starting Headspace,
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I've been consistent with meditation for much longer
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than I ever had previously.
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If you want to try Headspace,
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you can go to headspace.com slash special offer
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and you'll get a free one month trial
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with Headspace's full library of meditations
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for every situation.
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That's headspace.com slash special offer
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to get a one month free trial.
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That's their best offer out there right now.
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And then you can try their full library of meditations
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for every situation.
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Today, we're going to continue our discussion about hormones
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and we're going to focus on how particular hormones
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influence our energy levels and our immune system.
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Now, last episode, I mentioned at the end
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that we were concluding our month on hormones
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but we decided to include this additional episode.
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So this would be the fifth episode
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in the sequence of episodes about hormones
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because there are two hormones
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which are vitally important for a huge number
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of biological functions that we will talk about today
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but that are particularly important for energy levels
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and your immune system.
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This is something that I get asked about a lot.
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So rather than skip to the next general topic,
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today we're going to talk about the hormones cortisol
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and epinephrine, also called adrenaline.
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You do not have to have heard the previous episodes
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on hormones in order to understand and digest the material
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from today's podcast.
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If I mentioned anything related to previous episodes,
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I promise to give a little bit of quick background
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to get everyone up to speed.
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Today, we're going to talk about the biology of cortisol.
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We're going to talk about the biology of epinephrine.
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As always, we'll talk mechanism
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and there are going to be a lot of tools.
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If you're somebody who struggles with stress
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and energy levels and balancing stress and energy levels,
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today's episode is going to be vital for you.
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If you're somebody who has challenges with sleep
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or you're somebody who has challenges
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getting your energy level up throughout the day
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and getting your energy level down when you want to sleep,
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today's episode is also for you.
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And we're going to talk about the immune system
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and how to enhance the function of your immune system.
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We're also going to get into some fun topics
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related to learning and memory
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and how you can leverage cortisol
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and epinephrine in particular in order to learn faster.
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We're going to talk about so-called nootropics, smart drugs
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and how they work because there are several of them
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that tap into the epinephrine system
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that aren't often discussed and that you have access to.
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We're going to talk about how caffeine
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can actually rewire your brain for better or for worse.
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And we're going to talk about the biology of comfort foods
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and why they work so well and what they're doing.
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And in understanding that,
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you'll be able to better understand your food choices
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as they relate to short-term and long-term energy.
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So we have a lot to cover.
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Everything will be timestamped.
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I want to just remind people that we caption every episode
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in English and in Spanish.
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The captions take a day or two to pop up on YouTube.
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So if you're not seeing those within the first couple days,
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please be patient with us in order to get captions
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that actually read similarly to what I'm saying.
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We go through a captioning service
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and so we have them done by experts
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and that takes a little bit of additional time.
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Meanwhile, if you have any questions
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as the episode evolves, please write them down,
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please put them in the comment section,
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please subscribe to the channel if you haven't already
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and let's get started talking about
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how to increase your energy and improve
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and increase your immunity by leveraging the biology
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of cortisol and adrenaline.
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Before we dive into the biology of increasing energy
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and your immune system, I want to cover three topics
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that I promised I would mention from previous episodes.
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The first one relates to intermittent fasting.
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The second one relates to why your stomach grumbles.
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I forgot to mention the biology of that last time.
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And the third is a powerful way to increase growth hormone,
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which is powerful for increasing metabolism,
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fat burning and tissue repair, et cetera,
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that doesn't involve a sauna
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or wrapping yourself in plastic bags and going for a jog.
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So first, intermittent fasting.
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Last episode, I talked a lot about growth hormone
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and thyroid hormone and I mentioned things like sauna
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and exercise and sleep and how they can increase levels
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of growth hormone within the healthy ranges
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and why increasing growth hormone can be very beneficial
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because it can burn off body fat,
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it can improve muscle and general tissue health,
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cartilage, et cetera, and we tend to lose
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or our levels of growth hormone are reduced as we age.
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Many people ask me, well, what about fasting?
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Everyone's been promised on the internet
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that intermittent fasting leads to these big increases
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in growth hormone.
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The reason I didn't mention it is that I couldn't find
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a study that actually pointed to the underlying mechanism.
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I saw lots of claims, lots of podcasts,
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lots of degrees behind people's names,
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sometimes biologists, sometimes entirely different fields
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talking about this, but very few studies.
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And then I found what I would consider the study.
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We will link to this study.
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Turns out that fasting does increase growth hormone levels
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and the way that it does it is fascinating.
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I mentioned in a previous podcast about hunger
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and timing of meals and timing of hunger
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that when you're hungry, you release a hormone
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in your body called ghrelin,
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sometimes actually called ghrelin.
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Thanks for all of you ghrelinistas or ghrelinistas
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that corrected my pronunciation.
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It's both ghrelin or ghrelin, either one works.
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Ghrelin makes you hungry.
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When blood glucose, your blood sugar is low,
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ghrelin is secreted and makes you hungry.
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And it turns out that ghrelin, this hunger hormone,
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actually binds to the receptor in the brain
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that normally binds what's called
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growth hormone releasing hormone.
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So believe it or not, the hunger hormone
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can act like growth hormone releasing hormone
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and thereby stimulate growth hormone.
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Now, the levels of growth hormone that fasting promotes
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through this ghrelin system are pretty substantial.
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It's about a doubling of growth hormone levels
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in the waking state.
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So we know that you can release growth hormone in sleep.
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Intermittent fasting, it turns out,
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can increase growth hormone by binding ghrelin
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to the growth hormone releasing hormone receptor.
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And it does it also during the daytime.
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So yes, indeed, fasting can increase growth hormone,
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not to the supra levels that taking growth hormone
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would increase it or that a sauna could increase it,
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but it does seem to increase growth hormone.
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Later in today's episode,
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we're going to talk a lot about different patterns
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of fasting and eating that can control epinephrine.
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And so we will return to specifics about how long a fast.
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Do you need to fast for two or three days or 23 hours?
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Fortunately, for people like me who love to eat,
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that's not the case.
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So we'll talk specific fasting protocols
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later in the episode.
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We also said we were going to talk about tummy grumble.
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When your stomach growls,
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it is not because of fluid sifting around in there.
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A lot of people think, oh, you know,
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it's fluid sifting around.
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It turns out that your stomach has smooth muscle
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that lines its sides.
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And when you eat something or you don't,
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every once in a while,
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your stomach cinches off at the two ends like a bag
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with a hose on either end,
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because that's essentially what your digestive system is.
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And if there's nothing in there,
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what happens is the muscles that line the sides
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of your stomach,
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they kind of extend around the stomach in these cables.
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Those are always there.
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And if you have food in your stomach,
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what they do is they churn your stomach.
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They literally turn the muscles of your stomach
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like a tumbler to help break up the food
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that presumably you didn't chew well enough
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because you were eating too fast.
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When you don't have any food in your stomach,
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that churning continues.
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And that contraction of the muscle and the turning,
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literally turning over of your muscles,
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they don't flip over completely,
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but the turning over the muscles,
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that's what causes the stomach growling.
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If you don't want to be the person in the meeting
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or sitting there in a quiet theater
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whose stomach is growling, chew your food better.
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That's the simple solution.
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And last episode,
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I talked a lot about how sauna controlled safe hyperthermia
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can cause huge increases in growth hormone release,
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anywhere from 300 to 500,
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even 1,600% increases in growth hormone release,
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really staggeringly high increases.
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I point out that many people don't have saunas
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in their yard or in their homes,
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and they would go through some other measures
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to increase safely their body heat,
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creating a steam room in their bathroom
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00:13:38.000
or jogging with extra sweats on, this kind of thing.
link |
00:13:41.100
Many of you asked about hot baths.
link |
00:13:42.860
Hot baths will increase growth hormone, excuse me.
link |
00:13:46.080
However, the temperatures that you need
link |
00:13:48.220
in order to increase growth hormone
link |
00:13:50.640
are high enough that you run the risk of burn.
link |
00:13:52.820
And so I really can't make any recommendations
link |
00:13:54.820
about hot baths, but if you can tolerate a nice hot bath,
link |
00:13:57.620
you are going to get some growth hormone release.
link |
00:13:59.580
However, the sauna has this advantage
link |
00:14:01.260
of you being able to enter 175 degree
link |
00:14:04.140
or 200 degree environment,
link |
00:14:05.780
provided you're not pregnant, you're not a young child,
link |
00:14:08.300
et cetera, you can do that safely.
link |
00:14:10.300
And getting big increases in growth hormone,
link |
00:14:12.360
the hot bath will lead to lesser increases
link |
00:14:14.940
in growth hormone.
link |
00:14:16.540
We're going to talk a lot about temperature regulation
link |
00:14:18.240
in a future episode, but as always,
link |
00:14:20.780
if you're ever going to start playing with hypothermia
link |
00:14:23.500
or hypothermia, cold baths, ice baths, hot showers,
link |
00:14:27.140
hot baths that are beyond the kind of norm
link |
00:14:29.020
of what's comfortable, you have to be extremely careful
link |
00:14:31.900
and please consult a doctor.
link |
00:14:33.500
I think it's fair to say that most people
link |
00:14:35.420
would like to have a lot of energy during the day,
link |
00:14:38.460
if you work during the day,
link |
00:14:40.540
and they'd like their energy to taper off at night.
link |
00:14:43.860
And I think it's fair to say that most people
link |
00:14:45.700
don't enjoy being sick, nobody wants to get sick.
link |
00:14:49.800
In other words, you want to have energy
link |
00:14:51.800
and you want your immune system to function well,
link |
00:14:54.820
to ward off infections of various kinds,
link |
00:14:56.900
bacterial infections, viral infections, et cetera.
link |
00:15:00.180
And it turns out that the two hormones
link |
00:15:02.300
that dominate those processes of having enough energy
link |
00:15:05.900
and having a healthy immune system
link |
00:15:07.980
are cortisol and epinephrine.
link |
00:15:10.820
Epinephrine is the same thing as adrenaline.
link |
00:15:14.540
In the body, we tend to call adrenaline adrenaline
link |
00:15:17.620
and in the brain, we tend to call adrenaline epinephrine.
link |
00:15:20.940
And I'm sorry for that, I didn't create this naming system.
link |
00:15:24.380
And the story behind it is uninteresting
link |
00:15:26.620
and not worth our time.
link |
00:15:27.620
I will use the words adrenaline and epinephrine
link |
00:15:30.540
interchangeably today.
link |
00:15:32.740
Cortisol is cortisol.
link |
00:15:34.420
And I just want to cover a little bit
link |
00:15:36.440
about what cortisol and epinephrine are,
link |
00:15:38.820
where they are released in the body and brain,
link |
00:15:42.060
because if you can understand that,
link |
00:15:44.240
you will understand better how to control them.
link |
00:15:48.620
First of all, cortisol is a steroid hormone,
link |
00:15:53.300
much like estrogen and testosterone,
link |
00:15:56.880
in that it is derived from cholesterol.
link |
00:16:00.660
Now that could be cholesterol that you eat.
link |
00:16:03.060
It could be cholesterol that's produced by the liver.
link |
00:16:06.060
As many of you probably know,
link |
00:16:07.300
the relationship between dietary cholesterol,
link |
00:16:10.780
the fats that you eat and blood cholesterol
link |
00:16:14.420
and liver cholesterol is a very controversial one.
link |
00:16:17.740
It's a barbed wire topic.
link |
00:16:19.660
There are people that claim that dietary cholesterol
link |
00:16:21.660
has zero impact on circulating cholesterol
link |
00:16:25.380
coming from the liver.
link |
00:16:26.260
There are people who argue the exact opposite,
link |
00:16:29.260
both with good data in hand, I would say.
link |
00:16:32.200
There are some problems for the idea
link |
00:16:34.700
that all your cholesterol levels
link |
00:16:36.380
are determined by dietary intake,
link |
00:16:39.660
namely that anorexics often have very high levels
link |
00:16:43.020
of cholesterol that their liver produces,
link |
00:16:44.660
even though they are eating very little
link |
00:16:46.100
and sometimes not eating at all.
link |
00:16:47.940
So understand that cholesterol is a precursor molecule,
link |
00:16:52.340
meaning it's the substrate from which a lot of things
link |
00:16:54.580
like testosterone and estrogen are made.
link |
00:16:57.100
Please also understand that cholesterol can be made
link |
00:17:00.080
into estrogen or testosterone or cortisol,
link |
00:17:03.700
and that cortisol is sort of the competitive partner
link |
00:17:07.800
to estrogen and testosterone.
link |
00:17:09.320
What this means is no matter how much cholesterol
link |
00:17:12.380
you're eating or you produce,
link |
00:17:13.760
whether or not it's low or it's high,
link |
00:17:15.700
if you are stressed, more of that cholesterol
link |
00:17:19.180
is going to be devoted toward creating cortisol,
link |
00:17:23.060
which is indeed a stress hormone.
link |
00:17:25.500
However, the word stress shouldn't stress you out
link |
00:17:28.820
because you need cortisol.
link |
00:17:30.240
Cortisol is vital.
link |
00:17:31.420
You don't want your cortisol levels to be too low.
link |
00:17:34.220
It's very important for immune system function,
link |
00:17:36.460
for memory, for not getting depressed.
link |
00:17:39.260
You just don't want your cortisol levels to be too high,
link |
00:17:41.980
and you don't want them to be elevated
link |
00:17:44.660
even to normal levels at the wrong time of day.
link |
00:17:47.900
So we're going to talk about how to control
link |
00:17:49.980
the timing and level of your cortisol.
link |
00:17:53.300
Epinephrine or adrenaline has also been demonized a bit.
link |
00:17:59.300
We think of it as this stress hormone,
link |
00:18:01.560
this thing that makes us anxious, fight or flight.
link |
00:18:03.980
You know, we used to get chased by lions
link |
00:18:05.560
and tigers and bears, and now we don't,
link |
00:18:07.660
and it's this ancient hangover.
link |
00:18:09.240
That's all wrong.
link |
00:18:10.260
The fact of the matter is that epinephrine
link |
00:18:12.220
is your best friend when it comes to your immunity,
link |
00:18:15.960
when it comes to protecting you from infection,
link |
00:18:18.860
and we're going to talk about why,
link |
00:18:20.620
and epinephrine, adrenaline, is your best friend
link |
00:18:24.020
when it comes to remembering things
link |
00:18:25.760
and learning and activating neuroplasticity.
link |
00:18:28.460
We're going to talk about that as well.
link |
00:18:29.940
Once again, it's a question of how much and how long
link |
00:18:33.220
and the specific timing of release of cortisol
link |
00:18:35.580
and epinephrine, as opposed to cortisol and adrenaline
link |
00:18:39.340
being good or bad.
link |
00:18:40.580
They're terrific when they're regulated.
link |
00:18:43.260
They are terrible when they're misregulated,
link |
00:18:45.420
and we will give you lots of tools to regulate them better.
link |
00:18:48.900
Cortisol biology 101 in less than two minutes.
link |
00:18:54.280
Your brain makes what we call releasing hormones,
link |
00:18:57.460
and in this case, there's corticotropin-releasing hormone,
link |
00:19:00.180
CRH, is made by neurons in your brain.
link |
00:19:03.180
It causes the pituitary, this gland that sits
link |
00:19:06.060
about an inch in front of the roof of your mouth
link |
00:19:08.620
and the base of your brain, to release ACTH.
link |
00:19:13.580
ACTH then goes and causes your adrenals,
link |
00:19:17.000
which sit above your kidneys in your lower back,
link |
00:19:19.940
to release cortisol, a so-called stress hormone.
link |
00:19:23.400
But I would like you to think about cortisol
link |
00:19:25.700
not as a stress hormone, but as a hormone of energy.
link |
00:19:30.180
It produces a situation in the brain and body
link |
00:19:33.300
whereby you want to move
link |
00:19:36.060
and whereby you don't want to rest
link |
00:19:39.080
and whereby you don't want to eat, at least at first.
link |
00:19:45.100
Epinephrine or adrenaline 101 in less than two minutes.
link |
00:19:50.200
When you sense a stressor with your mind
link |
00:19:52.500
or your body senses a stressor, excuse me,
link |
00:19:55.580
from a wound or something of that sort,
link |
00:19:58.780
a signal is sent to neurons that are
link |
00:20:00.940
in the middle of your body.
link |
00:20:02.140
They're called the sympathetic chain ganglia.
link |
00:20:03.940
The name doesn't necessarily matter.
link |
00:20:05.820
They release norepinephrine very quickly.
link |
00:20:07.780
It's almost like a sprinkler system
link |
00:20:10.220
that just hoses your body with epinephrine.
link |
00:20:15.560
That will increase heart rate, will increase breathing rate.
link |
00:20:18.500
In some cases, it will constrict your blood vessels.
link |
00:20:20.900
It will also increase the size of vessels and arteries
link |
00:20:25.420
that are giving blood flow to your vital organs.
link |
00:20:28.960
This is why your extremities get cold when you're stressed
link |
00:20:32.260
and your heart is beating faster.
link |
00:20:33.580
More of that energy is being devoted toward your core.
link |
00:20:37.880
You also release adrenaline from your adrenals
link |
00:20:42.960
in, again, riding atop your kidneys.
link |
00:20:46.740
Those are a second system whereby your system gets flooded
link |
00:20:50.860
with adrenaline in pulses.
link |
00:20:52.860
So you can get one pulse, you can get 10 pulses.
link |
00:20:54.540
We'll talk about how to regulate the number of pulses.
link |
00:20:57.340
And you release it from an area of your brain
link |
00:20:59.160
called locus coeruleus,
link |
00:21:00.780
and that creates alertness in your brain.
link |
00:21:03.380
If you want to learn more about the stress response
link |
00:21:06.880
and all the details of that,
link |
00:21:08.240
including some protocols of how to regulate stress,
link |
00:21:10.420
please see our episode about stress.
link |
00:21:12.340
I go into a lot of detail there.
link |
00:21:15.360
I will touch on some of the same themes today,
link |
00:21:17.540
but I really want to cover energy and the immune system.
link |
00:21:21.540
And if you're very much interested in stress per se
link |
00:21:24.220
and stress regulation, please see the episode on stress.
link |
00:21:28.580
Okay, so we have cortisol and we have epinephrine,
link |
00:21:32.180
and their net effect is to increase energy.
link |
00:21:34.380
So first of all, I want to give you a tool
link |
00:21:37.500
that will help you regulate cortisol
link |
00:21:42.740
and can also help stave off
link |
00:21:45.580
certain patterns of mental illness.
link |
00:21:48.100
Now, of course, it's not going to cure mental illness
link |
00:21:49.820
on its own, but it can support healthy state of mind
link |
00:21:53.340
and can help reduce unhealthy states of mind,
link |
00:21:55.700
including depression.
link |
00:21:57.260
So the first tool is to make sure
link |
00:21:58.980
that your highest levels of cortisol
link |
00:22:01.420
are first thing in the morning when you wake up.
link |
00:22:03.960
One way or another, every 24 hours,
link |
00:22:06.420
you will get an increase in cortisol.
link |
00:22:08.500
That is non-negotiable.
link |
00:22:09.780
That is written into your genome.
link |
00:22:12.220
That increase in cortisol is there to wake you up
link |
00:22:16.420
and to make you alert.
link |
00:22:17.980
It's to stimulate movement from being asleep,
link |
00:22:21.020
presumably horizontal,
link |
00:22:22.900
to getting up and starting to move about your day.
link |
00:22:26.000
And I've said it before, but I will say it again,
link |
00:22:28.460
the best way to stimulate that increase in cortisol
link |
00:22:32.060
at the appropriate time is that very soon after waking,
link |
00:22:35.700
within 30 minutes or so after waking,
link |
00:22:38.300
get outside, view some sunlight.
link |
00:22:41.460
Even if it's overcast, get outside, view some sunlight,
link |
00:22:44.160
no sunglasses, never look at any light so bright
link |
00:22:47.620
that it could damage your eyes,
link |
00:22:48.540
but do that for two to 10 minutes.
link |
00:22:51.020
If it's very bright, two minutes.
link |
00:22:52.300
If it's not so bright, 10 minutes.
link |
00:22:54.660
Do that because in the early part of the day,
link |
00:22:57.740
you have the opportunity to time that cortisol release
link |
00:23:01.260
to the early part of the day, which will improve.
link |
00:23:04.900
This has been backed by peer reviewed studies.
link |
00:23:06.640
It will improve your focus.
link |
00:23:08.300
It will improve your energy levels
link |
00:23:10.460
and it will improve your learning throughout the day.
link |
00:23:13.460
It will also prevent a late shift in cortisol increase
link |
00:23:18.780
and late shifted cortisol, meaning cortisol that increases
link |
00:23:21.860
around eight or 9 p.m. is a signature feature
link |
00:23:25.900
of many depressive disorders,
link |
00:23:27.740
including major depression, anxiety.
link |
00:23:30.540
And that of course correlates
link |
00:23:31.740
with things like insomnia, et cetera.
link |
00:23:33.740
So that's a key tool.
link |
00:23:35.780
And I don't know how many of you are already doing that,
link |
00:23:38.580
but it is vital to do.
link |
00:23:40.420
Now I mentioned sunlight even on cloudy days
link |
00:23:43.340
and there are specific reasons for that.
link |
00:23:44.900
So I want to just briefly cover the data
link |
00:23:48.000
because in the episodes on sleep,
link |
00:23:49.680
I talked about brightness of light
link |
00:23:51.240
in regulating cortisol and sleep.
link |
00:23:53.620
And I talked about how to measure lux brightness,
link |
00:23:56.900
but I was not specific enough.
link |
00:23:59.140
I realized based on the questions
link |
00:24:00.860
that I've received since that episode.
link |
00:24:02.500
So here's how it works.
link |
00:24:04.160
Going outside and getting some sunlight requires
link |
00:24:07.580
that I also tell you how long and under what conditions.
link |
00:24:11.240
I've said looking through a window is not as good.
link |
00:24:13.420
It takes 50 times longer to get as much light,
link |
00:24:15.860
et cetera, et cetera.
link |
00:24:17.860
Many, many questions have told me
link |
00:24:19.180
that I'm not being specific enough.
link |
00:24:20.620
So I'm going to give you the data
link |
00:24:22.100
and from the data you will understand exactly
link |
00:24:24.220
how long you need to do this each day.
link |
00:24:26.660
On a sunny day, so no cloud cover,
link |
00:24:29.440
provided that the sun is not yet overhead,
link |
00:24:32.940
it's somewhere low in the sky,
link |
00:24:34.620
could have just crossed the horizon
link |
00:24:35.900
or if you wake up a little bit later,
link |
00:24:36.980
it could be somewhat low in the sky.
link |
00:24:39.980
Basically the intensity of light,
link |
00:24:42.060
the brightness is somewhere around 100,000 lux.
link |
00:24:44.980
Lux is just a measurement of brightness.
link |
00:24:47.180
If you want to download the app Light Meter,
link |
00:24:50.460
that is a free app that will allow you to do that.
link |
00:24:52.500
You can hold your finger down on the little button there
link |
00:24:56.320
and you can move it around
link |
00:24:57.480
and it will continuously give you a lux readout.
link |
00:24:59.300
It's not perfect, it's not exact,
link |
00:25:01.500
but it's pretty good and it is zero cost.
link |
00:25:04.260
I have no relationship to Light Meter, the company.
link |
00:25:08.260
On a cloudy day, it's about 10,000 lux.
link |
00:25:12.020
So 10 fold reduction, but bright artificial light,
link |
00:25:15.820
very bright artificial light,
link |
00:25:17.960
is somewhere around 1,000 lux.
link |
00:25:21.540
And ordinary room light
link |
00:25:24.140
is somewhere around 100 to 200 lux.
link |
00:25:27.780
And it has to do with how much light scatter there is.
link |
00:25:29.920
So even if you have a very bright bulb
link |
00:25:31.420
sitting right next to you, that's not going to do the job.
link |
00:25:33.700
Your phone will not do the job, not early in the day.
link |
00:25:36.360
To get the cortisol released at the appropriate time,
link |
00:25:39.660
you need to get outside.
link |
00:25:41.380
So let's just set a couple general parameters.
link |
00:25:44.660
If it's bright outside and no cloud cover,
link |
00:25:48.340
the light can be indirect,
link |
00:25:49.700
you don't have to be staring into the sun,
link |
00:25:51.020
please don't damage your eyes.
link |
00:25:52.340
We can't regenerate those neurons yet
link |
00:25:54.240
and restore vision that's lost.
link |
00:25:56.060
But if you have to blink, that means it's too bright.
link |
00:25:58.460
It's fine to blink, of course, please do if you need to.
link |
00:26:01.820
Get outside for 10 minutes
link |
00:26:04.820
or five minutes should suffice,
link |
00:26:07.220
but 10 minutes is sure to suffice.
link |
00:26:09.660
If it's a cloudy day, dense overcast,
link |
00:26:12.240
you're probably going to need about 30 minutes.
link |
00:26:14.340
If it's light cloud, broken cloud cover,
link |
00:26:16.140
it's probably going to be somewhere
link |
00:26:17.260
between 10 and 20 minutes.
link |
00:26:19.220
And if you can't get outside or you're on an airplane
link |
00:26:21.580
and it's bright overhead artificial lights
link |
00:26:24.980
or ordinary room lights,
link |
00:26:26.540
it's going to take you about six hours of light.
link |
00:26:29.260
And by time you reach the middle
link |
00:26:32.060
of your sort of wakeful period, it's too late.
link |
00:26:34.740
You won't be able to shift your clock
link |
00:26:36.000
and your cortisol will start drifting later and later.
link |
00:26:38.340
This is why it's vital to get this light on a regular basis,
link |
00:26:42.140
to get that cortisol released early in the day.
link |
00:26:44.700
That sets you up for optimal levels of energy.
link |
00:26:47.580
It sets you up for great sleep,
link |
00:26:49.420
but today's not really about sleep, it's more about energy.
link |
00:26:52.820
That cortisol pulse and the stress
link |
00:26:54.580
that you might feel early in the day
link |
00:26:56.020
from having a little bit extra energy,
link |
00:26:58.700
that is the energy that you want in order to move about
link |
00:27:02.140
and learn and do various things.
link |
00:27:03.900
That is a healthy level of energy.
link |
00:27:06.100
So please try and get that sunlight
link |
00:27:10.140
if it's within your protocols to do that
link |
00:27:12.680
and try and get sufficient sunlight
link |
00:27:14.140
first thing in the morning, again, within the first hour.
link |
00:27:16.460
That's the best way to make sure
link |
00:27:17.780
that you time your cortisol appropriately.
link |
00:27:20.260
Now, throughout the day,
link |
00:27:21.180
you're going to experience different things.
link |
00:27:23.860
Most of you are not spending your entire day
link |
00:27:25.860
trying to optimize your health.
link |
00:27:27.540
Some of you might be, but most of you have jobs
link |
00:27:30.320
and you have families and you have commitments.
link |
00:27:32.520
Life enters the picture and provides you stressors.
link |
00:27:35.980
And those stressors, whatever they may happen to be,
link |
00:27:38.620
a difficult coworker, some disappointment about something,
link |
00:27:42.180
you didn't get the raise you expected
link |
00:27:43.700
or you didn't get the vacation that you expected,
link |
00:27:46.260
those will cause increases in cortisol and epinephrine.
link |
00:27:50.780
This is important to understand.
link |
00:27:52.500
You don't have the luxury
link |
00:27:54.480
of just having this morning cortisol
link |
00:27:56.140
and then having it taper off.
link |
00:27:57.580
You want that major cortisol early in the day,
link |
00:27:59.860
but then you can expect, you should expect,
link |
00:28:02.820
increases in cortisol and adrenaline throughout the day
link |
00:28:05.960
based on events that are unpleasant to you.
link |
00:28:08.180
So for me, the events that are most unpleasant to me
link |
00:28:10.420
are things like traffic,
link |
00:28:12.380
emails that ask me to fill out a form
link |
00:28:14.560
for which I can't find the link.
link |
00:28:16.100
These kinds of things stress me out.
link |
00:28:17.660
I'm a human being.
link |
00:28:18.840
I don't lose my cool over them,
link |
00:28:20.380
but I can feel my level of alertness
link |
00:28:22.960
and kind of frustration increase.
link |
00:28:24.340
The normal kind of things that go with stress
link |
00:28:26.440
tense up a little bit.
link |
00:28:28.500
The key is these blips in cortisol and epinephrine
link |
00:28:32.060
need to be brief.
link |
00:28:33.860
You can't have them so often or lasting so long
link |
00:28:37.920
that you are in a state of chronic cortisol elevation
link |
00:28:41.380
or chronic epinephrine elevation.
link |
00:28:43.960
This system of stress was designed
link |
00:28:46.520
to increase your alertness and mobilize you towards things,
link |
00:28:49.180
get you frustrated and provide the opportunity
link |
00:28:52.500
to change behavior.
link |
00:28:53.420
That's what they were designed to do.
link |
00:28:54.580
So if you find yourself getting stressed
link |
00:28:57.540
and staying stressed,
link |
00:28:58.780
there are great tools that we provide in the stress episode
link |
00:29:01.740
that relate to things like the double inhale exhale,
link |
00:29:04.400
the so-called physiological psi.
link |
00:29:05.980
You can incorporate an NSDR, a non-sleep deep
link |
00:29:08.140
breast protocol, et cetera.
link |
00:29:10.100
But understand that the energy that you experience
link |
00:29:13.500
during stress, that sudden increase in alertness
link |
00:29:16.460
and attention that comes from seeing something difficult,
link |
00:29:18.920
that is a healthy hormonal system and neural system
link |
00:29:22.020
that's working.
link |
00:29:22.860
And the reason it works is that cortisol,
link |
00:29:25.720
when it's released into the bloodstream,
link |
00:29:27.480
it actually can bind to receptors in the brain.
link |
00:29:30.920
It can bind receptors in the amygdala, fear centers
link |
00:29:33.340
and threat detection centers,
link |
00:29:34.340
but also areas of the brain that are involved in learning
link |
00:29:37.320
and memory and neuroplasticity.
link |
00:29:39.340
And this is why I say that neuroplasticity,
link |
00:29:41.540
the brain's ability to change itself
link |
00:29:42.900
in response to experience is first stimulated
link |
00:29:47.380
by attention and focus
link |
00:29:48.980
and often a low level state of agitation.
link |
00:29:52.020
So understand that, and you won't be quite so troubled
link |
00:29:56.300
about the little stress increases
link |
00:29:58.060
that you experience throughout the day.
link |
00:30:00.100
Now, there are ways to leverage stress,
link |
00:30:03.640
epinephrine and cortisol in ways that serve you
link |
00:30:06.180
and to do it in a deliberate way.
link |
00:30:08.020
There are also ways to do that
link |
00:30:10.300
that increase your level of stress threshold,
link |
00:30:13.060
meaning they make it less likely
link |
00:30:15.920
that epinephrine and cortisol will be released.
link |
00:30:18.940
So I want to talk about the science of those practices
link |
00:30:21.140
because I get asked about these practices a lot,
link |
00:30:23.440
things like Wim Hof breathing,
link |
00:30:25.220
which is also called Tummo breathing,
link |
00:30:26.980
things like ice baths,
link |
00:30:28.300
things like high intensity interval training.
link |
00:30:31.120
All of those things have utility.
link |
00:30:34.760
The question is how you use them
link |
00:30:36.820
and how often you use them.
link |
00:30:39.100
Those tools, just like stress from a life event
link |
00:30:43.500
can either enhance your immunity or deplete it.
link |
00:30:46.300
That's right, those same practices of ice baths,
link |
00:30:48.980
Tummo breathing, high intensity interval training
link |
00:30:51.500
or training of any kind can deplete your immune system
link |
00:30:53.960
or it can improve them.
link |
00:30:56.420
Excuse me, they can improve it,
link |
00:30:58.160
meaning they can improve your immune system.
link |
00:31:00.980
The key is how often you use them and when.
link |
00:31:04.220
And so I want to review that now
link |
00:31:05.860
in light of the scientific literature,
link |
00:31:08.040
because in doing that,
link |
00:31:08.960
you can build practices into your daily
link |
00:31:11.340
or maybe every other day routine
link |
00:31:13.180
that can really help buffer you
link |
00:31:14.860
against unhealthy levels of cortisol and epinephrine,
link |
00:31:18.940
meaning cortisol increases that are much too great
link |
00:31:21.580
or that last much too long.
link |
00:31:23.300
Epinephrine increases that are much too great
link |
00:31:25.580
or that last much too long.
link |
00:31:27.320
And of course, we'll talk about all the negatives
link |
00:31:30.460
that go along with having too much cortisol,
link |
00:31:32.340
too much epinephrine for too long,
link |
00:31:34.220
but you hear about those a lot.
link |
00:31:35.660
You hear about Cushing syndrome,
link |
00:31:36.760
you hear about abdominal fat accumulation,
link |
00:31:39.260
you hear about sleep disturbances.
link |
00:31:40.780
I want to arm you with the tools first
link |
00:31:42.780
and then we can talk about the dark side
link |
00:31:45.580
and all the things that hopefully
link |
00:31:46.480
you'll be able to avoid entirely
link |
00:31:48.180
or that you can get yourself out of
link |
00:31:49.400
once you have the tools in hand.
link |
00:31:51.400
Let's say somebody tells you something very troubling
link |
00:31:54.340
or you look at your phone and you see a text message
link |
00:31:56.540
that's really upsetting to you.
link |
00:31:58.200
That will cause an immediate increase
link |
00:32:01.300
in epinephrine, adrenaline in your brain and body.
link |
00:32:05.280
And chances are it's going to increase
link |
00:32:07.260
your levels of cortisol as well.
link |
00:32:09.960
Let's say you get into an ice bath or a cold shower.
link |
00:32:13.480
Even if you love the cold or if you hate the cold,
link |
00:32:17.160
that will cause an equivalent increase
link |
00:32:19.960
in epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
00:32:22.280
We don't know the exact levels,
link |
00:32:23.560
but it's probably about the same.
link |
00:32:25.660
Let's say you go out for high intensity interval training.
link |
00:32:27.840
You decide you're going to run some sprints.
link |
00:32:29.800
You can do some repeats
link |
00:32:31.200
or you're going to do some weightlifting in the gym
link |
00:32:33.360
and you love lifting weights in the gym.
link |
00:32:35.640
Maybe you're like the powerlifting thing
link |
00:32:37.380
or you decide that you want to do some hot yoga
link |
00:32:39.880
or something that you really enjoy or you hate.
link |
00:32:44.520
You're going to increase your epinephrine
link |
00:32:46.400
and cortisol levels.
link |
00:32:47.600
There's simply no way around this.
link |
00:32:50.320
Let's say you decide to sit down
link |
00:32:51.800
and you're going to do some deep breathing.
link |
00:32:53.880
We all hear about the benefits of deep breathing.
link |
00:32:55.720
So inhale, exhale, inhale, exhale.
link |
00:32:57.940
You're going to get big increases
link |
00:32:59.760
in epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
00:33:01.880
The data from multiple studies support this.
link |
00:33:05.480
All of those are stressors in air quotes.
link |
00:33:09.840
Now there is a way that you can cognitively reframe
link |
00:33:13.340
what those are.
link |
00:33:14.180
You can tell yourself,
link |
00:33:15.000
I love high intensity interval training
link |
00:33:16.240
or I love weight training or I personally love exercise.
link |
00:33:19.760
I'm not crazy about the cold.
link |
00:33:21.600
I do some cold exposure stuff now and again
link |
00:33:23.840
and we're going to talk a lot about how to do that
link |
00:33:25.600
in the optimal way in an upcoming episode.
link |
00:33:28.960
But getting into the cold doesn't feel good to me.
link |
00:33:32.160
I tell myself it's good for me and I enjoy it
link |
00:33:35.640
at some point usually when I'm getting out.
link |
00:33:38.520
All of those increase epinephrine and guess what?
link |
00:33:41.040
They increase your levels of energy and alertness.
link |
00:33:44.200
So if you're somebody who struggles
link |
00:33:46.060
with energy and alertness, it can be beneficial
link |
00:33:49.700
provided you get clearance from your doctor
link |
00:33:51.420
to have some sort of protocol built into your day
link |
00:33:54.260
where you deliberately increase your levels of epinephrine
link |
00:33:58.280
and your levels of cortisol.
link |
00:34:00.640
And I want to put the emphasis on deliberately.
link |
00:34:03.280
So how would you do that?
link |
00:34:04.700
Well, it's quite easy to turn the shower cold
link |
00:34:08.100
and get into that.
link |
00:34:08.940
That will wake you up and it literally wakes you up
link |
00:34:11.400
because of increases in epinephrine.
link |
00:34:14.080
You can do deep breathing of the sort
link |
00:34:15.600
where you inhale and exhale repeatedly 25 or 30 times,
link |
00:34:19.880
maybe hold your breath for a few seconds on an exhale
link |
00:34:22.600
and then repeat so-called Wim Hof or Tummo type breathing.
link |
00:34:25.280
Lots of adrenaline is released into your system.
link |
00:34:27.520
When you do that, you will have more energy afterwards.
link |
00:34:30.840
So it's really important to understand
link |
00:34:32.720
that the body doesn't distinguish
link |
00:34:34.660
between a troubling text message, ice, Tummo breathing
link |
00:34:38.920
or high intensity interval training
link |
00:34:40.200
or any other kind of exercise.
link |
00:34:41.520
It's all stress.
link |
00:34:43.800
Cognitively reframing that and telling yourself,
link |
00:34:46.360
I like this, I enjoy it is not going to change
link |
00:34:49.480
the way that that molecule impacts your body and brain.
link |
00:34:53.160
I sort of chuckle because people would love to tell you
link |
00:34:56.700
that all you have to do is say, oh, this is good for me.
link |
00:34:58.880
No, what it does to tell yourself that it's good for you
link |
00:35:03.100
or that you enjoy it is that it liberates other molecules
link |
00:35:06.360
like dopamine and serotonin
link |
00:35:08.680
that help buffer the epinephrine response.
link |
00:35:12.040
Now, the way that it does that,
link |
00:35:13.440
I've talked about previous episode,
link |
00:35:14.840
but I'll just mention that dopamine
link |
00:35:17.000
is the precursor to epinephrine.
link |
00:35:19.080
Epinephrine, adrenaline is made from dopamine.
link |
00:35:23.640
Cortisol is made from cholesterol.
link |
00:35:26.500
Epinephrine is made from dopamine.
link |
00:35:28.920
And that's why if you tell yourself
link |
00:35:30.400
you're enjoying something
link |
00:35:32.180
and because dopamine is so subjective
link |
00:35:34.080
that you can in some ways,
link |
00:35:36.120
as long as you're not completely lying to yourself,
link |
00:35:37.880
you can get more epinephrine, you get more mileage
link |
00:35:41.680
or more ability to push through something
link |
00:35:44.320
and you can sort of reframe it,
link |
00:35:46.000
but it's not really cognitive reframing.
link |
00:35:47.800
The cognitive part is the trigger,
link |
00:35:49.480
but it's a chemical substance
link |
00:35:51.960
that's actually occurring there.
link |
00:35:53.300
It's dopamine giving you more epinephrine,
link |
00:35:56.800
a bigger amplitude epinephrine release,
link |
00:35:59.400
and it gives you some sense of control.
link |
00:36:02.120
So here's a protocol that anyone can use
link |
00:36:05.520
if you want to increase levels of energy,
link |
00:36:07.280
if you suffer from low energy during the daytime
link |
00:36:10.520
or whenever it is that you'd like to be alert.
link |
00:36:13.360
Pick a practice that you can do fairly consistently,
link |
00:36:16.360
maybe every day,
link |
00:36:17.660
but maybe every third day or every fourth day,
link |
00:36:20.280
maybe it's an ice bath or a cold bath,
link |
00:36:22.760
maybe it's a cold shower,
link |
00:36:24.260
maybe it's the cyclic inhale exhale breathing protocol
link |
00:36:28.800
I described, if that wasn't clear
link |
00:36:30.360
and people always ask for a demo,
link |
00:36:31.720
I'm not going to do the whole thing right now,
link |
00:36:33.440
but I'm willing to do a few rounds of this
link |
00:36:35.400
or a few cycles I should say.
link |
00:36:36.780
So it's inhale,
link |
00:36:39.960
I would do that more deeply,
link |
00:36:40.960
more like you do that 25, 30 times repeatedly,
link |
00:36:45.880
you will start to feel warm,
link |
00:36:47.480
people in the yoga community,
link |
00:36:48.840
they say you're generating heat,
link |
00:36:49.960
you're not generating heat, releasing adrenaline.
link |
00:36:54.160
Inhale, exhale, inhale, exhale,
link |
00:36:55.840
25 or 30 times, you will feel agitated and stressed,
link |
00:36:59.600
that's because you're releasing adrenaline in your body
link |
00:37:02.260
and that's because you're releasing norepinephrine
link |
00:37:04.520
in your brain and you'll be more alert.
link |
00:37:07.800
Then you can follow that 25 or 30 breath cycles
link |
00:37:10.240
with an exhale hold
link |
00:37:12.560
and hold your breath for 15 to 30 seconds.
link |
00:37:14.840
Always, always, always do this on dry land,
link |
00:37:17.860
never while driving, operating heavy machinery,
link |
00:37:19.880
all of the standard safety protocols, never near water,
link |
00:37:22.800
please, people have passed out and died doing this
link |
00:37:26.120
with breath holds in water,
link |
00:37:27.680
there are several deaths associated with it,
link |
00:37:29.680
on land it's probably safer, clear it with your doctor,
link |
00:37:32.040
but 25, 30 breaths, exhale, hold,
link |
00:37:34.580
25, 30 breaths again, exhale, hold,
link |
00:37:37.000
25, 30 breaths again, exhale, hold,
link |
00:37:39.980
and then if you like, you can do an inhale and hold
link |
00:37:42.640
if that's within your margins of safety.
link |
00:37:46.200
So if all these protocols,
link |
00:37:47.960
all these activities are just equivalent,
link |
00:37:50.720
they're just stress, then how do we make them good for us?
link |
00:37:54.000
How do we actually benefit from them?
link |
00:37:55.920
Now, of course, the cold itself
link |
00:37:57.980
can have some health promoting effects,
link |
00:38:00.000
it can increase brown fat thermogenesis and metabolism,
link |
00:38:03.280
high intensity interval training or other forms of exercise
link |
00:38:06.560
of course has cardiovascular effects that can be good for us
link |
00:38:10.640
as does weight training, et cetera,
link |
00:38:12.340
but what we're talking about here
link |
00:38:14.080
are ways to increase energy and to teach our brain and body,
link |
00:38:18.580
to teach ourselves how to regulate the stress response.
link |
00:38:22.080
So in addition to the benefits of the actual practices,
link |
00:38:25.480
what we're talking about is building a system
link |
00:38:28.940
so that when you experience increases
link |
00:38:31.920
in epinephrine and cortisol from life events,
link |
00:38:34.720
you're able to better buffer those,
link |
00:38:36.500
and we are also talking about
link |
00:38:38.320
ways that you can increase energy overall,
link |
00:38:41.140
because that's what today's episode is all about,
link |
00:38:43.100
energy and the immune system.
link |
00:38:45.100
And indeed, we will talk about
link |
00:38:46.700
how you can actually leverage specific protocols
link |
00:38:49.080
to increase your immune system on demand.
link |
00:38:51.860
There's great scientific data to support
link |
00:38:54.340
that one can do that.
link |
00:38:56.340
So there's a biological mechanism that's very important
link |
00:39:00.640
if you want to do those things,
link |
00:39:02.180
increase energy and your immune system on demand,
link |
00:39:04.960
learn to buffer stress on demand in real time.
link |
00:39:08.640
And it means taking these protocols, these practices,
link |
00:39:13.100
whether or not it's cold water or ice bath or exercise
link |
00:39:16.740
or any of those, and making one small
link |
00:39:20.900
but very powerful adjustment in how you perform them.
link |
00:39:24.020
But in order to make that adjustment,
link |
00:39:25.760
I can't just tell you the adjustment,
link |
00:39:27.700
I have to tell you the mechanism
link |
00:39:29.180
so that you know if you're doing it correctly or not.
link |
00:39:31.720
This is really a case where
link |
00:39:33.020
if you can understand a little bit of mechanism,
link |
00:39:35.780
you will be far better off than just adopting protocols.
link |
00:39:41.820
So if you take away nothing else from this episode,
link |
00:39:46.140
except what I'm about to tell you,
link |
00:39:48.500
please take away the information I'm about to tell you.
link |
00:39:52.660
Cortisol, as I mentioned, is released from the adrenals
link |
00:39:55.860
and it can bind to receptors,
link |
00:39:57.660
it can have action both in the body and in the brain.
link |
00:40:01.060
In fact, it can bind the so-called
link |
00:40:02.620
threat detection center in the brain, or one of them,
link |
00:40:05.620
which is the amygdala, also called the fear center.
link |
00:40:09.460
It can do that because cortisol
link |
00:40:10.900
can cross the blood brain barrier,
link |
00:40:12.680
it can be released in the body
link |
00:40:13.900
and cross this biological barrier,
link |
00:40:16.100
it's like a fence that keeps things out of the brain,
link |
00:40:18.500
but cortisol has passing rights, it can go through.
link |
00:40:22.980
Epinephrine cannot, epinephrine is polarized,
link |
00:40:26.620
the shape of it is such that it can't make it
link |
00:40:30.380
through the blood brain barrier.
link |
00:40:32.500
That's one of the reasons why it's released
link |
00:40:34.700
both from the adrenals in your body
link |
00:40:36.900
and released from this brainstem area,
link |
00:40:39.020
the locus coeruleus in your brain.
link |
00:40:42.380
That's a powerful thing because what it means
link |
00:40:45.220
is that the body can enter states of readiness
link |
00:40:49.860
and alertness while the mind remains calm,
link |
00:40:53.920
that is biologically possible,
link |
00:40:55.820
it's not just a psychological trick
link |
00:40:58.920
and there are ways that one can do that.
link |
00:41:01.080
So I'm presuming at this point
link |
00:41:03.520
that you're getting your morning light
link |
00:41:05.020
to time your cortisol increase.
link |
00:41:07.420
I'm presuming that you want more energy
link |
00:41:09.980
or that you want to increase your immune system,
link |
00:41:12.500
its function and its ability to combat infections
link |
00:41:14.920
of various kinds.
link |
00:41:16.820
And what I'm suggesting is that you pick from the palette
link |
00:41:20.300
of exercises that are out there
link |
00:41:24.180
or tools that are out there to increase epinephrine,
link |
00:41:26.940
there are a lot of ways to do that.
link |
00:41:28.900
You can do that as I mentioned,
link |
00:41:30.360
through cold water, through exercise,
link |
00:41:32.200
you can even do that by having confrontations
link |
00:41:34.860
with other people.
link |
00:41:36.740
At a biological level, it is identical.
link |
00:41:39.360
So if you like to go online and place the kind of comments
link |
00:41:42.500
that will read the kinds of things
link |
00:41:44.180
or look at the kinds of things that agitate you,
link |
00:41:46.820
you can, if you like, look at that as an opportunity.
link |
00:41:49.260
I'm not suggesting you do that,
link |
00:41:50.540
I'd like to see people taking care of themselves
link |
00:41:52.780
and each other in much less destructive ways, frankly,
link |
00:41:56.140
but the prerequisite here is getting an increase
link |
00:42:01.140
in adrenaline released from the body.
link |
00:42:04.300
Now, the simplest way to describe how to do that
link |
00:42:07.860
would be in the context of cold water
link |
00:42:09.640
or a breathing protocol,
link |
00:42:10.940
because then I don't have to deal
link |
00:42:12.340
with the unknown life circumstances that get you triggered
link |
00:42:15.900
or I could tell you what gets me triggered,
link |
00:42:17.820
but I'm not going to.
link |
00:42:19.060
So let's presume cold water.
link |
00:42:21.660
So let's say you decide you're going to take a cold shower.
link |
00:42:24.340
You get into the cold shower and if it's cold enough,
link |
00:42:27.180
that will be stressful,
link |
00:42:28.100
you will experience an increase in epinephrine.
link |
00:42:31.360
It will increase your alertness.
link |
00:42:33.540
Now you're using this as a practice,
link |
00:42:36.020
as a tool to build, you could call it resilience,
link |
00:42:38.380
but the ability to stay calm in the mind
link |
00:42:40.580
while being stressed in the body, epinephrines in the body.
link |
00:42:44.020
And you do that by subjectively trying to calm yourself.
link |
00:42:47.620
Now you can do that by telling yourself it's good for you,
link |
00:42:50.060
by emphasizing your exhales,
link |
00:42:52.260
anything that you can do to try and stay calm
link |
00:42:54.880
despite the fact that you are
link |
00:42:56.020
in a heightened state of alertness.
link |
00:42:58.500
You do this with exercise, you could do this with music,
link |
00:43:00.920
pretty much anything that will give you
link |
00:43:02.540
a really heightened state of alertness
link |
00:43:05.460
offers you the opportunity to try and stay calm in the mind.
link |
00:43:08.040
What you're trying to do at a mechanistic level
link |
00:43:11.420
is to have adrenaline released from the adrenals,
link |
00:43:15.220
but not have adrenaline epinephrin released
link |
00:43:18.100
from the brainstem to the same degree.
link |
00:43:20.540
So you're not just trying to buffer this.
link |
00:43:22.120
You're not trying to say, oh, this is good for me,
link |
00:43:23.400
this is good for me, I'm going to grind this out.
link |
00:43:24.940
You're not trying to grind it out.
link |
00:43:26.620
You're trying to move through this calmly
link |
00:43:29.900
while maintaining alertness.
link |
00:43:31.460
You're not trying to zone out necessarily,
link |
00:43:33.820
although maybe that helps.
link |
00:43:35.340
You're not trying to distract yourself.
link |
00:43:36.840
What you're trying to do is shift cognitively
link |
00:43:40.820
your relationship to the somatic,
link |
00:43:43.300
to the body stress response.
link |
00:43:45.620
Now I'm sure some of you out there are shouting,
link |
00:43:47.100
yeah, that's exactly like whatever, whatever, whatever.
link |
00:43:49.840
I agree.
link |
00:43:50.680
This is in many ways a self-directed
link |
00:43:53.660
kind of stress inoculation,
link |
00:43:54.900
but we're not talking about this as stress inoculation.
link |
00:43:58.080
We're talking about this as a way
link |
00:43:59.820
to increase energy and focus.
link |
00:44:03.180
And the reason is that epinephrin when released in the body
link |
00:44:08.060
has a profound effect on the immune system.
link |
00:44:11.140
And when released in the brain has a profound effect
link |
00:44:14.180
on the ability to learn and remember information
link |
00:44:17.180
and to be alert.
link |
00:44:18.380
And so we're talking about splitting the location,
link |
00:44:21.020
separating the location from which you have
link |
00:44:24.060
epinephrin adrenaline released, okay?
link |
00:44:26.420
So let's say you are doing this practice simply to wake up.
link |
00:44:30.260
Okay, cold shower, we'll do that.
link |
00:44:31.740
Exercise, we'll do that.
link |
00:44:34.360
The ability to stay calm in mind
link |
00:44:36.180
while having heightened levels of adrenaline
link |
00:44:38.740
and presumably cortisol as well in the body,
link |
00:44:40.840
but the cortisol is going to circulate everywhere.
link |
00:44:43.460
We'll talk a little bit about cortisol more in a moment.
link |
00:44:46.160
You could do that through some self-soothing, calming way.
link |
00:44:50.780
That's going to be highly individual.
link |
00:44:53.060
You do it by telling yourself you enjoy it, et cetera.
link |
00:44:56.020
But what you need to understand is that
link |
00:44:57.820
in the immediate period following that practice,
link |
00:45:01.860
your system, your entire brain and body are different.
link |
00:45:05.500
Your body is actually primed to resist infection
link |
00:45:10.140
when you have high levels of epinephrin in it
link |
00:45:12.260
for short periods of time.
link |
00:45:13.820
So the scientific study that explored
link |
00:45:15.740
how increasing adrenaline in the body
link |
00:45:18.540
can improve immune resistance is grounded
link |
00:45:21.700
in a well-known phenomenon that increases in stress
link |
00:45:26.380
actually protect you against infection in the short term.
link |
00:45:31.060
So I want to look at the classic data first,
link |
00:45:33.740
describe what was done,
link |
00:45:34.900
and then I want to talk about the more recent study
link |
00:45:37.100
which is immediately actionable.
link |
00:45:39.180
There are classic set of studies
link |
00:45:41.220
that are really based mainly on the work
link |
00:45:43.000
of somebody named Bruce McEwen
link |
00:45:44.520
who was at the Rockefeller University in New York.
link |
00:45:47.740
Bruce passed away a few years ago,
link |
00:45:49.620
but he had many decades of incredibly impactful work
link |
00:45:53.820
under his belt when he did.
link |
00:45:56.780
The work that I'm going to talk about next
link |
00:45:59.180
has been done in humans and has been done in animals
link |
00:46:02.740
and has really explored how inducing stress
link |
00:46:06.560
can enhance the function of the immune system
link |
00:46:08.700
in the short term.
link |
00:46:09.620
And when I mean short term, I mean about one to four days.
link |
00:46:14.380
I'm not going to go through all the details of the study,
link |
00:46:16.420
but essentially what they were doing was exposing subjects
link |
00:46:20.460
to some sort of infection,
link |
00:46:22.940
either bacterial or viral infection and inducing stress.
link |
00:46:27.140
Sounds like a double whammy, right?
link |
00:46:28.380
You think that maybe getting a little electric foot shock
link |
00:46:31.380
or cold water exposure
link |
00:46:33.380
or something to increase your levels of stress
link |
00:46:35.580
and adrenaline would just make the effects
link |
00:46:38.260
of the infection worse, but no, quite the opposite.
link |
00:46:42.060
Brief bouts of stress,
link |
00:46:44.040
which now you should be thinking about
link |
00:46:45.640
in terms of cortisol and epinephrine release,
link |
00:46:48.220
were actually able to increase immune system function.
link |
00:46:52.940
Now that shouldn't surprise you
link |
00:46:55.140
if you understand a little bit
link |
00:46:56.500
about how epinephrine works in the body and in the brain.
link |
00:47:00.740
It essentially is the signal
link |
00:47:03.260
by which the nervous system can inform immune organs,
link |
00:47:06.860
things like the spleen and other organs
link |
00:47:08.700
that make killer cells of various kinds,
link |
00:47:10.900
B cells and T cells,
link |
00:47:12.640
to go and combat infections, bacteria and viruses.
link |
00:47:16.300
How else would your immune system know
link |
00:47:18.020
that there was an infection?
link |
00:47:19.380
Your immune system can recognize foreign invaders,
link |
00:47:22.060
but the nervous system provides the signal,
link |
00:47:25.300
the sort of alarm signal that liberates the killer cells,
link |
00:47:28.420
that tells them there's a problem
link |
00:47:30.060
and to go seek out the problem, so to speak.
link |
00:47:33.120
So the duration here is really important
link |
00:47:36.780
because if stress stayed too high for too long,
link |
00:47:39.780
then yes, indeed, stress can hinder the immune response,
link |
00:47:44.940
but for a period of about one to four days,
link |
00:47:47.340
it actually can protect you
link |
00:47:49.100
by way of increasing the immune response.
link |
00:47:52.280
Now, I can say with certainty
link |
00:47:54.980
that that effect is governed by epinephrine,
link |
00:47:58.420
adrenaline released from the adrenals and not from the brain
link |
00:48:02.260
because they actually explored
link |
00:48:04.380
whether or not the effect exists
link |
00:48:06.220
in the presence of what's called an adrenalectomy
link |
00:48:09.760
or removing the adrenals.
link |
00:48:12.260
So I should just say without the adrenals,
link |
00:48:13.860
you don't get the effect.
link |
00:48:14.780
So we know that that effect comes from adrenaline
link |
00:48:16.660
in the body.
link |
00:48:17.720
What does that mean for you?
link |
00:48:18.800
That means if you want to increase your immune system
link |
00:48:21.840
in the short term,
link |
00:48:23.800
you want to increase your epinephrine in the short term.
link |
00:48:27.080
That's why short bouts of very intense exercise,
link |
00:48:30.300
probably no more than an hour per day,
link |
00:48:32.420
provided you're doing everything else right,
link |
00:48:33.880
sleeping and nutrition, et cetera,
link |
00:48:36.100
maybe even shorter bouts of intense exercise
link |
00:48:38.800
or exposure to cold water
link |
00:48:41.160
or the cyclic breathing that I talked about before.
link |
00:48:44.680
Because they increase epinephrine,
link |
00:48:46.740
they will bolster the immune system.
link |
00:48:49.140
And we all hear these reports every once in a while.
link |
00:48:51.980
It seems to be the thing that every once in a while,
link |
00:48:53.980
there'll be an article about how coffee
link |
00:48:55.700
can improve your immune system or something like that.
link |
00:48:57.580
Indeed, caffeine can increase epinephrine
link |
00:49:00.020
and dopamine to some extent,
link |
00:49:02.060
but most people are drinking it chronically.
link |
00:49:04.820
So its effects are probably due to increases in epinephrine
link |
00:49:09.100
and probably whether or not something like coffee
link |
00:49:11.500
or other forms of caffeine can improve
link |
00:49:13.300
or degrade your immune system
link |
00:49:14.820
will probably depend on whether or not
link |
00:49:16.500
you're using it in a way that it increases your adrenaline
link |
00:49:19.020
as a spike that happens rarely.
link |
00:49:21.500
Once every two or three months,
link |
00:49:23.960
let's say you have an infection coming on.
link |
00:49:25.400
Yes, indeed, what these data probably mean
link |
00:49:28.180
is that drinking some hot caffeinated tea
link |
00:49:30.920
or some hot coffee even provided you don't get dehydrated
link |
00:49:34.900
from it because you're also drinking some water
link |
00:49:37.120
can probably improve your immune system function
link |
00:49:39.340
by way of increasing adrenaline release.
link |
00:49:41.940
But so can the breathing, so can cold exposure,
link |
00:49:44.780
so can exercise.
link |
00:49:46.940
The mechanism here is what's key.
link |
00:49:48.620
And I keep saying that because what it means
link |
00:49:51.500
is that you don't actually have to know
link |
00:49:53.260
the specific protocol.
link |
00:49:54.580
I'm not trying to say, do this particular protocol.
link |
00:49:57.740
You have to figure out, and it should be easy to figure out
link |
00:50:00.540
what short-term adrenaline increasing behavior
link |
00:50:04.180
you're willing to do on a regular basis every day
link |
00:50:06.900
or two or three times a week.
link |
00:50:08.340
Now you could say, well, I'm not sick.
link |
00:50:10.400
Should I be doing these things often?
link |
00:50:13.420
I would say two or three times a week at a minimum,
link |
00:50:16.580
if your goal is to keep your immune system tuned up
link |
00:50:19.140
and you are in the presence of a lot of children,
link |
00:50:22.420
for instance, which carry a lot of bugs
link |
00:50:25.100
because their immune system isn't developed,
link |
00:50:26.960
or you work in a healthcare setting,
link |
00:50:30.160
or you're simply somebody who's prone to get sick.
link |
00:50:33.700
I can just say anecdotally,
link |
00:50:35.580
I guess someone now calls this anecdata,
link |
00:50:37.700
which I don't like that phrase because it's sort of,
link |
00:50:40.500
I don't want anecdotal data to ever be misunderstood
link |
00:50:43.820
as anything but anecdotal data.
link |
00:50:46.780
Anecdotally, I can say that I've had instances
link |
00:50:49.980
where I've felt a throat tickle coming on
link |
00:50:52.540
or some sinus infection.
link |
00:50:54.020
I will do the cyclic breathing that I described before,
link |
00:50:57.100
25, 30 breaths, exhale, hold, 25, 30 breaths,
link |
00:50:59.420
exhale, hold, 25, 30 breaths, exhale, hold,
link |
00:51:01.420
and then big inhale, hold.
link |
00:51:02.860
And most times I didn't get full-blown sick,
link |
00:51:05.660
but I also take other precautionary measures
link |
00:51:07.700
to get sleep, et cetera.
link |
00:51:09.960
So whether or not it was causal
link |
00:51:12.100
or whether or not it's just correlated, I don't know.
link |
00:51:14.580
However, there's a human study
link |
00:51:16.420
that I definitely want to point out to you
link |
00:51:18.780
because it was published more recently
link |
00:51:21.220
than the McEwen work.
link |
00:51:22.140
It was published in the Proceedings
link |
00:51:23.540
of the National Academy of Sciences for the USA
link |
00:51:26.380
because they're Proceedings of the National Academy
link |
00:51:28.140
of Sciences for many other countries as well.
link |
00:51:30.420
The title of the paper is voluntary activation
link |
00:51:32.740
of the sympathetic nervous system.
link |
00:51:34.240
That's the system that causes fight or flight
link |
00:51:36.200
and AK stress and causes release of adrenaline
link |
00:51:39.620
and attenuation of the innate immune response in humans.
link |
00:51:43.660
This is Cox, K-O-X et al, P-N-A-S,
link |
00:51:48.180
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2014.
link |
00:51:50.860
And they incorporate the ever famous Wim Hof breathing.
link |
00:51:53.900
Wim Hof breathing is much like the breathing protocol
link |
00:51:57.220
that I've described several times now in this podcast.
link |
00:52:00.140
It's also called Tummo breathing.
link |
00:52:02.220
Other people from other cultures and communities
link |
00:52:05.220
have called it other things.
link |
00:52:06.300
The naming really isn't important.
link |
00:52:08.440
Although I do think Wim is a pioneer
link |
00:52:10.060
in trying to bring these practices
link |
00:52:11.780
to the general public more broadly
link |
00:52:13.540
and was involved in this study.
link |
00:52:16.660
The study was done in the Netherlands.
link |
00:52:18.500
It was communicated by Dr. Thomas Horvath at Yale.
link |
00:52:22.780
I mentioned all that.
link |
00:52:24.180
Horvath is a terrific scientist.
link |
00:52:26.740
I'm familiar with his work over many years.
link |
00:52:29.380
Here's what they did.
link |
00:52:31.500
They injected people with E. coli
link |
00:52:36.500
and they had groups that either did the sorts of breathing
link |
00:52:40.740
I've been describing that increase adrenaline release.
link |
00:52:44.020
Although I should say, I don't think you need that breathing
link |
00:52:47.540
to get adrenaline release.
link |
00:52:48.620
You could do it with cold exposure.
link |
00:52:49.940
You could do it with other things,
link |
00:52:51.820
high intensity interval training as well.
link |
00:52:53.780
And what they found was that the response to the E. coli
link |
00:53:00.240
was quite different in the people that had a protocol,
link |
00:53:03.700
in this case, breathing to increase adrenaline.
link |
00:53:06.580
So this is a remarkable study
link |
00:53:09.540
because what they found was that the fever, the vomiting,
link |
00:53:12.060
all the negative effects of E. coli,
link |
00:53:15.940
many of them and in some cases, all of them
link |
00:53:18.300
were greatly attenuated
link |
00:53:20.620
by way of engaging the adrenaline system,
link |
00:53:24.020
in this case, using breathing.
link |
00:53:26.040
They looked at inflammatory cytokines, things like IL-6,
link |
00:53:29.660
which I've mentioned many times on this podcast,
link |
00:53:31.420
the sort of classic inflammatory cytokine were reduced.
link |
00:53:33.820
Things like IL-10, which are anti-inflammatory
link |
00:53:36.460
were increased.
link |
00:53:37.340
There were some inflammatory cytokines that were increased.
link |
00:53:41.480
What's the point here?
link |
00:53:42.320
The point is you can control your immune system
link |
00:53:45.140
by finding a way that you can increase adrenaline.
link |
00:53:49.060
And this runs counter to what we always hear,
link |
00:53:51.580
which is don't get too stressed or you will get sick.
link |
00:53:54.740
Learn to control adrenaline, turn it on and turn it off.
link |
00:53:58.520
Learn to control cortisol,
link |
00:54:00.020
turn it on with light in the morning, try and turn it off.
link |
00:54:02.740
And then when it spikes because of life events,
link |
00:54:05.660
learn to turn it off.
link |
00:54:07.840
Learning to turn on and off adrenaline,
link |
00:54:11.160
AKA epinephrine and learning to turn on and off cortisol
link |
00:54:16.160
affords you the ability to turn on energy and focus
link |
00:54:20.160
and your immune system.
link |
00:54:22.280
That's the most important point from today's podcast
link |
00:54:24.580
and understanding that it doesn't matter
link |
00:54:27.600
what protocol you use.
link |
00:54:28.960
Maybe it's a cup of coffee and running up a hill
link |
00:54:31.000
five or six times.
link |
00:54:31.960
That will improve your immune system function
link |
00:54:33.640
if you get adrenaline in your system.
link |
00:54:36.200
You can use an ice bath, you can use a cold bath.
link |
00:54:38.300
It really doesn't matter.
link |
00:54:40.440
You can get into an argument,
link |
00:54:41.440
but I'm not suggesting you do that.
link |
00:54:42.840
It really doesn't matter.
link |
00:54:44.480
What's important is that you're able to then shut off
link |
00:54:46.880
that response and there are ways to do that
link |
00:54:49.000
we will talk about, but I want to talk about
link |
00:54:50.440
some of the other benefits of epinephrine and cortisol
link |
00:54:54.640
that occur because of their actions on the brain,
link |
00:54:57.520
because these are many and they are powerful
link |
00:55:00.100
and they relate to energy, but also the ability to learn.
link |
00:55:03.560
If I haven't already convinced you that seeing light
link |
00:55:05.960
early in the day is good for timing your cortisol,
link |
00:55:09.240
I should also mention that another hormone
link |
00:55:11.520
that I discussed last episode, which is thyroid hormone,
link |
00:55:15.260
and it's critical for setting your level of metabolism
link |
00:55:18.560
is controlled in part by these circadian mechanisms
link |
00:55:24.060
and cortisol itself.
link |
00:55:27.380
The short takeaway on this is that if you get your cortisol
link |
00:55:31.720
release early in the day,
link |
00:55:33.360
it will increase your energy throughout the day.
link |
00:55:35.480
It will also time your thyroid release properly.
link |
00:55:39.580
So there's yet another reason why you would want to get
link |
00:55:43.180
that light exposure early in the day.
link |
00:55:45.280
For me, that's a non-negotiable practice.
link |
00:55:47.980
If I'm on a plane, I'll try and get it any way I can.
link |
00:55:51.040
I'm not shining flashlights in my eyes yet,
link |
00:55:53.700
but I really try hard to get that light exposure
link |
00:55:57.500
from sunlight early in the day without fail.
link |
00:56:01.420
And the thyroid increase has to do with the fact
link |
00:56:04.580
that your circadian clock itself is regulated by cortisol
link |
00:56:08.280
and the circadian clock times the release
link |
00:56:10.600
of thyroid hormone.
link |
00:56:11.920
I don't want to go too far off in that direction,
link |
00:56:14.720
but there are a number of studies,
link |
00:56:18.240
Kalsbeek et al, K-A-L-S-B-E-E-K et al, 2012,
link |
00:56:25.240
if you want to look it up on PubMed is a great one
link |
00:56:28.300
that describes how cortisol secretion begins to rise
link |
00:56:31.160
during sleep and peaks shortly after waking
link |
00:56:34.380
or immediately before.
link |
00:56:36.560
And that times a set of neurons in the circadian clock
link |
00:56:43.220
that then trigger the release of the releasing
link |
00:56:45.640
and stimulating hormones for thyroid.
link |
00:56:47.900
So a really important mechanism and thyroid will also tend
link |
00:56:52.120
to correlate with energy, but mostly metabolism.
link |
00:56:54.440
Very important to have thyroid in check.
link |
00:56:56.420
Now let's talk about epinephrine and cortisol
link |
00:56:58.400
and learning and memory.
link |
00:57:01.500
Everyone has a story about being so stressed
link |
00:57:03.720
they couldn't remember something,
link |
00:57:05.920
sit down to an exam, actually had this happen once,
link |
00:57:08.220
sat down to an exam and just blanked, just blanked.
link |
00:57:12.340
It only happened once, I don't know what happened.
link |
00:57:14.960
I don't think it was sleep deprivation,
link |
00:57:16.320
but I just completely blanked.
link |
00:57:18.440
And it was very hard for me to pull myself
link |
00:57:20.920
out of that ditch.
link |
00:57:22.040
I did manage to do it, but it was a scary experience.
link |
00:57:25.200
So I think most people think about stress
link |
00:57:27.320
and an inability to perform.
link |
00:57:29.320
However, most of the time increases in epinephrine
link |
00:57:33.960
provided they are not through the roof
link |
00:57:36.980
lead to improved performance.
link |
00:57:39.080
Now this has been shown over and over again on memory tests,
link |
00:57:42.520
on learning new information, on physical performance,
link |
00:57:47.600
that when blood levels of epinephrine are low,
link |
00:57:51.400
you don't perform very well.
link |
00:57:53.960
When blood levels of epinephrine are very high,
link |
00:57:56.720
up to about 1500 to 1700 picograms per mil,
link |
00:58:01.200
if anyone's out there who's actually measuring this stuff,
link |
00:58:03.600
but I doubt you are, performance goes way up.
link |
00:58:07.600
Performance gets better when you are alert
link |
00:58:10.200
and when you're a little bit stressed.
link |
00:58:13.160
Absolutely shown again and again and again.
link |
00:58:16.300
If you get too stressed, it's the mental side,
link |
00:58:19.720
it's the epinephrine in the brain that causes people
link |
00:58:22.000
to either focus on their somatic response too much,
link |
00:58:24.560
like they feel like they're sweating
link |
00:58:25.740
and they're focused on their bodily response
link |
00:58:27.560
and they're not focused on what it is they're trying to do
link |
00:58:29.320
or say or perform, et cetera, or learn.
link |
00:58:32.480
But epinephrine is a nootropic,
link |
00:58:36.120
it is a smart drug that we all make internally.
link |
00:58:39.480
And cortisol is as well.
link |
00:58:42.040
Now here's the twist.
link |
00:58:44.760
That does not mean that you want epinephrine high
link |
00:58:49.180
during the exam necessarily.
link |
00:58:53.800
Memory and learning and performance are actually favored,
link |
00:58:58.560
they are enhanced by epinephrine increases
link |
00:59:02.160
immediately after learning.
link |
00:59:04.800
And that's something that's rarely discussed,
link |
00:59:06.960
the timing is vital.
link |
00:59:08.760
So if you learn some information, you have a conversation,
link |
00:59:11.760
you're trying to learn a new language, a new motor skill,
link |
00:59:15.040
whatever it is that you're trying to learn,
link |
00:59:18.040
the increase in epinephrine that occurs just afterward
link |
00:59:22.480
is what's going to consolidate the information.
link |
00:59:25.520
It's going to ensure that the proper circuits and mechanisms
link |
00:59:28.380
in the brain for neuroplasticity are engaged during sleep
link |
00:59:31.160
later that night or the next night,
link |
00:59:32.440
which is when the real rewiring occurs.
link |
00:59:34.600
And you might say, that's crazy, why would that happen?
link |
00:59:37.380
Well, we have to remember none of these mechanisms evolved
link |
00:59:40.940
for us to do what we want and learn what we want necessarily
link |
00:59:44.260
although they will allow us to do that.
link |
00:59:46.940
We've experienced this before.
link |
00:59:49.140
We might have gotten up, gone outside, get in our car,
link |
00:59:53.080
drive to work or to somebody's house,
link |
00:59:54.980
you're not thinking about much at all.
link |
00:59:56.500
And then all of a sudden you see an accident on the road.
link |
00:59:59.160
Your alertness is primed
link |
01:00:01.520
if it happens to be a particularly gory accident,
link |
01:00:04.720
there's going to be a lot of sensory information there.
link |
01:00:08.080
All of a sudden adrenaline epinephrine
link |
01:00:09.760
is released into your brain and body.
link |
01:00:12.180
Guess what?
link |
01:00:13.120
Not only will you not forget that event,
link |
01:00:15.780
but you will remember everything that led up to that event,
link |
01:00:18.640
which has an adaptive function
link |
01:00:20.980
because your brain and body's primary concern is safety.
link |
01:00:25.280
This is the neurobiological explanation
link |
01:00:27.320
for Maslow's hierarchy of needs is safety first.
link |
01:00:30.860
And so you have heightened awareness and alertness
link |
01:00:32.880
for everything that preceded
link |
01:00:35.380
that spike in adrenaline and cortisol.
link |
01:00:39.000
So the way to think about this is
link |
01:00:41.220
if you need to learn something better,
link |
01:00:44.160
if you're taking Adderall
link |
01:00:45.520
or you're taking a lot of coffee beforehand,
link |
01:00:47.520
you're actually driving the process in the wrong direction.
link |
01:00:51.480
You're increasing epinephrine for learning, sure,
link |
01:00:54.000
but past a certain point,
link |
01:00:54.980
you're actually degrading learning and performance.
link |
01:00:57.860
The time to do that is toward the end
link |
01:01:00.480
or immediately after the learning
link |
01:01:02.400
because this mechanism is not simply devoted
link |
01:01:05.160
to negative events like a car crash or a trauma.
link |
01:01:08.940
It works to make sure that the hippocampus
link |
01:01:11.480
that encodes memories
link |
01:01:13.160
as part of the memory encoding mechanisms
link |
01:01:16.420
is primed that it's told
link |
01:01:18.880
what you just experienced is important.
link |
01:01:20.600
You're going to need that information later.
link |
01:01:23.520
And so I've talked many times before
link |
01:01:25.200
about using non-sleep deep rest,
link |
01:01:28.080
NSDR or ensuring good night's sleep after learning.
link |
01:01:31.400
But what we're also talking about is
link |
01:01:33.840
as the learning event tapers off,
link |
01:01:36.320
as you're exiting that
link |
01:01:37.920
to make sure that your epinephrine levels
link |
01:01:39.780
are not tapering off as well.
link |
01:01:41.760
And this may be one of the reasons why the 90 minute cycle,
link |
01:01:45.200
the so-called ultradian cycle for learning works
link |
01:01:47.560
because it takes a few minutes
link |
01:01:48.520
to get into rhythm of learning.
link |
01:01:50.400
You can maintain that alertness for about 90 minutes.
link |
01:01:53.760
It's no coincidence that these podcasts
link |
01:01:55.960
are typically about 90 minutes long.
link |
01:01:58.840
And as you exit that 90 minutes
link |
01:02:02.360
you're going to start to feel fatigued.
link |
01:02:05.080
You're not going to be able to continue
link |
01:02:06.460
to secrete epinephrine at the same level.
link |
01:02:08.920
So I'm not telling you that at the end of this podcast
link |
01:02:11.200
you should give yourself a foot shock
link |
01:02:13.080
or that you should jump into an ice bath.
link |
01:02:14.780
Although I will say
link |
01:02:15.620
if you were to increase your epinephrine
link |
01:02:17.400
at the end of this episode
link |
01:02:18.640
by breathing or by way of cold shower,
link |
01:02:21.040
I'm willing to bet based on numerous published studies
link |
01:02:25.140
that the memory for the information would be enhanced
link |
01:02:29.180
because of this retroactive effect
link |
01:02:31.860
of epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
01:02:34.340
Put simply, you can remember things better
link |
01:02:37.040
if you increase your alertness,
link |
01:02:39.040
AKA your level of epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:02:41.920
after, immediately after something that you want to learn.
link |
01:02:46.040
So I'm reminded by people here at the Huberman Lab Podcast
link |
01:02:48.820
that the optimal strategy therefore
link |
01:02:51.000
would be a 90 minute session of focus or learning.
link |
01:02:55.640
Then immediately after cold shower or tumor type breathing
link |
01:03:00.680
or ice bath or something of that sort,
link |
01:03:02.920
maybe a hard run or hit training
link |
01:03:04.960
if you can't get access to the other things.
link |
01:03:07.120
And then shower up and do a non-sleep deep rest
link |
01:03:11.240
and then get a good night's sleep.
link |
01:03:12.360
Those would be the optimal tools and the organization of
link |
01:03:16.280
tools for enhanced learning.
link |
01:03:18.700
And of course you could use caffeine
link |
01:03:20.360
to prime the whole process by drinking the caffeine
link |
01:03:23.640
towards the tail of the learning episode,
link |
01:03:25.400
which is counterintuitive at least to me.
link |
01:03:27.880
I should mention since many of you use caffeine
link |
01:03:30.580
and I use caffeine, I do drink coffee,
link |
01:03:32.400
I love mushroom coffee, I love mate,
link |
01:03:35.560
I drink caffeine in various forms,
link |
01:03:38.640
that there was a study that came out recently
link |
01:03:41.300
that is relevant to our discussion about energy
link |
01:03:44.300
and alertness and learning.
link |
01:03:47.140
And the study came out just recently in March, 2021.
link |
01:03:51.400
It's Maghalas et al, so M-A-G-A-L-H-A-E-S.
link |
01:03:58.380
And it was published in Molecular Psychiatry,
link |
01:04:00.420
which is a fine journal, a peer review journal.
link |
01:04:02.580
And the title pretty much gives it away.
link |
01:04:05.700
Habitual coffee drinkers display a distinct pattern
link |
01:04:09.120
of brain functional connectivity.
link |
01:04:11.800
Chronically drinking coffee changes brain connectivity.
link |
01:04:15.000
And it does it in a number of ways,
link |
01:04:16.820
but the key takeaways from this study,
link |
01:04:19.380
as it relates to sort of what the circuits do,
link |
01:04:22.820
as opposed to me just listing off a bunch of brain circuits,
link |
01:04:25.200
which is kind of meaningless in this conversation,
link |
01:04:28.240
is that people who drank coffee habitually every day
link |
01:04:33.460
had changes in their brain circuitry
link |
01:04:35.340
such that there was a shift or a bias
link |
01:04:38.760
toward anxiety even when they don't ingest caffeine.
link |
01:04:43.680
So a lot of times we think,
link |
01:04:44.700
oh, caffeine increases your levels of anxiety.
link |
01:04:47.340
And indeed it appears it does if you use it chronically,
link |
01:04:50.560
but not just to caffeine.
link |
01:04:53.840
It doesn't just raise your baseline of anxiety
link |
01:04:56.100
because of what's circulating in your bloodstream.
link |
01:04:57.900
It actually increases connectivity
link |
01:04:59.580
between the brain areas that relate to anxiety.
link |
01:05:02.820
Now that could be a good thing or a bad thing,
link |
01:05:04.380
depending on how you look at it.
link |
01:05:05.540
For people that are prone to chronic panic attacks
link |
01:05:10.200
or anxiety attacks, that's not going to be good.
link |
01:05:12.260
Some people might use caffeine in healthy ways,
link |
01:05:14.860
I believe I do,
link |
01:05:15.680
in order to just increase overall levels of alertness.
link |
01:05:18.360
Although now not only am I going to start
link |
01:05:20.420
delaying my caffeine intake
link |
01:05:22.140
till two hours after I wake up
link |
01:05:23.580
for reasons I've talked about in previous episodes,
link |
01:05:27.100
but I'm also going to start drinking it later
link |
01:05:29.700
in learning and focus sessions
link |
01:05:32.600
as a way to enhance plasticity
link |
01:05:34.460
around those learning and focus sessions not before.
link |
01:05:37.580
So interesting study, feel free to, it's free online.
link |
01:05:40.500
You can access the full paper online.
link |
01:05:42.140
We will put a link as well.
link |
01:05:43.940
I want to mention this issue of nootropic,
link |
01:05:46.020
so-called smart drugs,
link |
01:05:47.060
which is not a topic that I particularly enjoy
link |
01:05:50.340
because I don't like the name.
link |
01:05:51.460
I don't like the idea of a nootropic
link |
01:05:52.900
because what is a smart drug?
link |
01:05:54.260
Well, there's different kinds of smart.
link |
01:05:56.860
There's creativity, there's task switching,
link |
01:06:00.000
there's strategy building, there's strategy implementation.
link |
01:06:02.860
And most of the nootropics that are out there
link |
01:06:05.580
are just cocktails of a bunch of different things
link |
01:06:07.420
that aren't tailored to the individual at all.
link |
01:06:09.540
They all seem to have some caffeine
link |
01:06:12.340
or some cholinergic stimulation, et cetera.
link |
01:06:14.620
But there's an important way to frame this
link |
01:06:16.060
in light of today's conversation.
link |
01:06:17.940
Nootropics generally fall into two categories.
link |
01:06:19.860
One category are nootropics that increase blood glucose.
link |
01:06:24.860
So these are compounds that people take
link |
01:06:26.820
that increase blood glucose,
link |
01:06:27.920
and increasing blood glucose will improve performance
link |
01:06:32.060
and can enhance learning in some situations.
link |
01:06:34.620
I'm not suggesting people take these things,
link |
01:06:36.020
but here's just a list of a few of those.
link |
01:06:38.000
Some of them are legal, some of them are gray market,
link |
01:06:40.220
some of them are illegal.
link |
01:06:43.300
Piracetams, oxiracetams, the aniracetams, all the tams, okay?
link |
01:06:49.580
Elevate blood glucose, that's how they work.
link |
01:06:52.040
The neural effects that you hear are secondary or tertiary
link |
01:06:55.060
to the fact that they just increase blood glucose.
link |
01:06:57.300
We know that because if you block the blood glucose effect,
link |
01:06:59.500
you block the nootropic effect, okay?
link |
01:07:02.660
Others include, and definitely don't take these please,
link |
01:07:05.660
amphetamine, cocaine, those will increase learning
link |
01:07:09.820
in the short term in particular dosages,
link |
01:07:12.100
but because they increase blood glucose.
link |
01:07:15.020
And then of course, things like painful stimuli or stress
link |
01:07:19.060
will improve learning by way of increasing blood glucose.
link |
01:07:22.860
Now, stress and epinephrine that's associated with it
link |
01:07:26.420
not only improve performance during the learning bout,
link |
01:07:31.320
but as I mentioned before,
link |
01:07:32.440
having epinephrine come up afterward
link |
01:07:34.680
will increase the retention of that information
link |
01:07:36.800
in the long-term.
link |
01:07:38.080
And then of course, there's a whole category
link |
01:07:39.760
of nootropics that don't impact blood glucose
link |
01:07:44.220
that work by increasing the cholinergic system activity.
link |
01:07:47.540
And these are things like choline, lecithin, phosostigmine,
link |
01:07:51.160
it's a prescription drug, phosphatidylstyrene.
link |
01:07:55.080
So there are ways to increase energy
link |
01:07:57.480
that don't require increasing blood glucose.
link |
01:08:00.000
And this is vitally important.
link |
01:08:02.460
The reason we're talking about epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:08:04.800
for increasing energy and immune system function
link |
01:08:07.160
is because they are largely independent of blood glucose.
link |
01:08:11.220
Of course, they interact with that system,
link |
01:08:13.400
but we heard so much growing up, you need to eat for energy,
link |
01:08:17.040
but the energy that we're talking about today
link |
01:08:19.640
is actually a much more powerful one
link |
01:08:21.160
than the one that you derive from food.
link |
01:08:22.840
It's, we could call it neural energy.
link |
01:08:25.040
It's neurotransmitters that create alertness and focus
link |
01:08:28.000
and the willingness and the ability to move
link |
01:08:30.560
and the willingness and ability for immune system
link |
01:08:33.160
to move in response to intruders.
link |
01:08:35.560
So I think we all too often think about food as energy,
link |
01:08:39.680
which is great because it is,
link |
01:08:42.620
but there are other sources of energy that are neural
link |
01:08:45.880
and they relate to these hormone systems,
link |
01:08:47.860
cortisol and epinephrine,
link |
01:08:49.040
and that's what we're focused on today.
link |
01:08:51.720
So up until now, we've been talking about increasing energy
link |
01:08:55.020
and increasing the immune system
link |
01:08:57.060
by way of cortisol and epinephrine,
link |
01:08:59.620
but I'd be totally remiss if I didn't cover
link |
01:09:02.520
how cortisol and epinephrine, if chronically elevated
link |
01:09:07.360
or if elevated too high,
link |
01:09:09.120
can have a lot of detrimental effects.
link |
01:09:12.640
These are the things we normally hear about.
link |
01:09:14.600
I'm going to describe some of those things,
link |
01:09:17.000
but I'm also going to talk about ways to ameliorate them,
link |
01:09:20.760
ways that you can adjust the cortisol levels
link |
01:09:23.720
even if you're stressed,
link |
01:09:24.720
ways that you can adjust epinephrine levels
link |
01:09:26.600
even if you're stressed
link |
01:09:27.880
so that they have less of a negative impact.
link |
01:09:32.120
I don't have to list off all the ways
link |
01:09:33.560
that stress is terrible and chronic stress is terrible.
link |
01:09:36.520
I think you know.
link |
01:09:37.800
Insomnia, your immune system over time will get battered
link |
01:09:41.580
and you won't be able to fight infection off as well, right?
link |
01:09:44.680
You don't want to be stressed for too long.
link |
01:09:47.580
You can start laying down the sort of classic pattern
link |
01:09:50.920
of cortisol-induced body fat.
link |
01:09:52.800
In fact, there's a whole literature related to comfort foods
link |
01:09:57.640
and why we want to consume comfort foods
link |
01:10:00.740
under conditions of chronic stress.
link |
01:10:03.220
And it's quite interesting actually
link |
01:10:04.840
because it reveals something
link |
01:10:05.800
about the biology of chronic stress
link |
01:10:07.560
that's informative for how to prevent it
link |
01:10:10.740
or to down-regulate chronic stress once it's occurred.
link |
01:10:15.060
So let's talk for a second about comfort foods.
link |
01:10:17.600
And the work that I'm going to refer to
link |
01:10:19.360
is work that was done by a very impressive scientist
link |
01:10:22.240
by the name of Mary Dalman.
link |
01:10:24.440
Her work goes back decades.
link |
01:10:26.800
She was at University of California, San Francisco.
link |
01:10:29.480
And she asked this question that on the face of it
link |
01:10:32.580
seems kind of obvious,
link |
01:10:33.600
but for which there was no mechanism known
link |
01:10:35.920
until Mary and her lab personnel came along.
link |
01:10:39.880
And the question was, why do we seek high fat
link |
01:10:42.840
and or high sugar foods when we are stressed for awhile?
link |
01:10:46.760
Why would that be?
link |
01:10:48.440
And the reason is that the so-called glucocorticoids
link |
01:10:52.400
of which cortisol is a glucocorticoid
link |
01:10:56.700
is caused as we've mentioned before
link |
01:10:58.160
by releasing hormones from the brain
link |
01:10:59.560
and ACTH from the pituitary, et cetera.
link |
01:11:02.200
But normally high levels of glucocorticoid
link |
01:11:05.200
shut off the releasing hormones in the brain
link |
01:11:08.760
and in the pituitary.
link |
01:11:10.520
They shut down in a so-called negative feedback loop.
link |
01:11:13.720
So just like if testosterone or estrogen get too high,
link |
01:11:17.720
that's read out or that is seen so to speak
link |
01:11:22.040
by neurons in the pituitary and brain.
link |
01:11:23.960
And then we shut down our production
link |
01:11:26.620
of estrogen and testosterone.
link |
01:11:31.380
If cortisol levels get too high,
link |
01:11:33.000
if there's too much cortisol
link |
01:11:33.880
floating around in our bloodstream,
link |
01:11:35.360
there's a negative feedback loop
link |
01:11:36.720
and the brain and pituitary shut down CRH and ACTH
link |
01:11:40.680
which would otherwise stimulate more cortisol.
link |
01:11:42.700
So cortisol levels go down.
link |
01:11:44.480
So it's a beautiful negative feedback loop.
link |
01:11:47.340
Chronic stress, however,
link |
01:11:49.040
stress that lasts more than four to seven days
link |
01:11:53.120
and there's a way to think about
link |
01:11:54.680
what chronic stress really is in an actionable way
link |
01:11:57.680
causes changes in the feedback loop
link |
01:12:01.240
between the adrenals and the brain and the pituitary
link |
01:12:06.700
such that now the brain and the pituitary
link |
01:12:08.600
respond to high levels of glucocorticoids, cortisol
link |
01:12:11.320
by releasing more of them.
link |
01:12:12.760
It becomes a positive feedback loop.
link |
01:12:15.320
And that's bad.
link |
01:12:16.180
It actually gets right down to levels of gene regulation
link |
01:12:19.780
and transcription and translation.
link |
01:12:21.600
And so you really don't want chronic stress
link |
01:12:23.780
because it's a cascade of stress equals more stress
link |
01:12:27.640
equals more stress.
link |
01:12:28.460
So this is why it's very important
link |
01:12:29.680
to learn to turn off the stress response.
link |
01:12:32.520
You don't want it elevated for too long.
link |
01:12:34.900
So there's one study that Dalman and her colleagues did
link |
01:12:37.520
where they stimulate chronic stress
link |
01:12:39.320
by increasing corticosterone cortisol.
link |
01:12:43.000
And they found that subjects would increase their consumption
link |
01:12:46.700
of sugar and fat.
link |
01:12:48.800
In fact, they would even eat lard.
link |
01:12:50.480
It would just, it sounds disgusting
link |
01:12:52.560
but they were willing to just eat more fat and more sugar.
link |
01:12:55.440
And that led to all sorts of things like type 2 diabetes
link |
01:12:59.200
that led to dysfunction in the adrenal output, et cetera.
link |
01:13:03.520
And so the real key is to learn
link |
01:13:05.400
to shut off the stress response
link |
01:13:07.600
because the interesting thing is,
link |
01:13:08.880
is that Dalman and colleagues and some studies
link |
01:13:11.100
that followed up on their work found
link |
01:13:13.240
that if the system was kicked into motion for too long,
link |
01:13:17.680
then there was a tremendous shift overall towards anxiety
link |
01:13:22.200
because it turns out that body fat itself
link |
01:13:24.460
receives neural innervation.
link |
01:13:26.160
It received neurons actually talk to body fat.
link |
01:13:28.420
So now you have body fat releasing certain hormones.
link |
01:13:32.160
You've got the adrenals releasing cortisol
link |
01:13:35.040
and all of that is feeding back to the brain
link |
01:13:37.080
to make you want more sugar and fatty foods.
link |
01:13:40.180
So that's how the so-called comfort foods work.
link |
01:13:43.200
And you should watch yourself next time
link |
01:13:45.220
you experience stress.
link |
01:13:46.440
If it's a short-term bout of stress,
link |
01:13:48.000
typically it blocks hunger.
link |
01:13:50.840
If it's a longer bout of stress,
link |
01:13:52.760
typically it triggers hunger in particular
link |
01:13:54.920
for these so-called comfort foods, sugary and fatty foods.
link |
01:13:57.680
And it's kind of interesting how short-term stress
link |
01:14:00.880
can actually block hunger.
link |
01:14:03.440
It does that by activating or interacting
link |
01:14:07.760
with a system called the bombicin system.
link |
01:14:10.960
Bombicin is a peptide hormone.
link |
01:14:14.040
It was actually, I think it was named
link |
01:14:16.140
after some sort of reptile or amphibian,
link |
01:14:18.520
excuse me, some sort of toad.
link |
01:14:20.120
I think it was initially sequenced from the toad
link |
01:14:24.040
before it was later discovered in humans.
link |
01:14:25.880
And I think the toad's Latin name is Bombina bombina
link |
01:14:29.300
or something of that sort.
link |
01:14:30.380
And so they decided to call this thing bombicin,
link |
01:14:32.840
but it reduces eating and stress liberates bombicin
link |
01:14:37.400
and makes you want to eat less.
link |
01:14:38.760
But chronic stress causes all these positive feedback
link |
01:14:42.000
changes, which are not positive.
link |
01:14:43.800
They're positive, I'm calling them positive
link |
01:14:45.880
because they amplify the stress response over and over,
link |
01:14:48.480
not because they are good for you.
link |
01:14:51.400
So short-term stress, great.
link |
01:14:54.340
Long-term stress, really, really bad.
link |
01:14:56.660
Other bad effects of stress that we can talk about,
link |
01:14:59.320
and I won't list off too many more of these
link |
01:15:00.940
because you know so many of them, you hear about them,
link |
01:15:03.040
you really want to know how to control them, I'm guessing,
link |
01:15:05.240
is that yes, indeed, stress can make you go gray.
link |
01:15:09.900
The rates at which people go gray, meaning gray hair,
link |
01:15:13.560
some cases gray body hair as well,
link |
01:15:16.320
depend on some genetic factors.
link |
01:15:18.500
There are a couple of ways that we can go gray.
link |
01:15:22.280
There's actually a stem cell,
link |
01:15:24.360
what they call niche in every follicle.
link |
01:15:26.160
So you have stem cells in the follicle
link |
01:15:27.500
that can produce more and more of the given hair cell.
link |
01:15:30.000
And they're actually peroxide groups.
link |
01:15:32.120
You know, we hear about bleaching hair with peroxide,
link |
01:15:33.880
at least in the 80s, that was a thing,
link |
01:15:35.440
but you can use hydrogen peroxide to bleach things,
link |
01:15:37.800
and you can produce your own peroxide in the hair follicle
link |
01:15:41.840
that will cause the hairs to go gray.
link |
01:15:43.980
In addition, pigmentation of hair,
link |
01:15:46.840
just like pigmentation of skin,
link |
01:15:48.320
is controlled by melanocytes.
link |
01:15:51.600
Our old friends, the melanocytes.
link |
01:15:52.960
And I say old friends because on previous episodes,
link |
01:15:54.880
I talked about why sunlight and getting ample sunlight
link |
01:15:58.040
can increase levels of certain things
link |
01:16:01.520
like melanocyte-stimulating hormone,
link |
01:16:03.240
which reduce hunger,
link |
01:16:04.200
it can improve testosterone and estrogen levels,
link |
01:16:07.080
and all the reasons for that.
link |
01:16:08.560
Well, it turns out that activation
link |
01:16:11.760
of the so-called sympathetic nervous system,
link |
01:16:13.960
which is really just another name for the system
link |
01:16:16.500
that liberates adrenaline from the adrenals
link |
01:16:19.880
and epinephrine in the brain,
link |
01:16:22.080
drives depletion of melanocytes in hair stem cells.
link |
01:16:26.780
So indeed, there's a rate of aging
link |
01:16:28.600
that we will undergo based on our genetics,
link |
01:16:30.920
but stress will make us go gray.
link |
01:16:33.080
And the paper that you should look to
link |
01:16:35.000
if you want to read more about this,
link |
01:16:36.080
came out very recently.
link |
01:16:37.200
This is Zang et al, Z-H-A-N-G et al,
link |
01:16:41.040
Nature, fabulous journal,
link |
01:16:43.000
definitely one of the apex journals, 2020.
link |
01:16:46.300
So this paper showed that the activation of stress
link |
01:16:51.560
in various forms will deplete these melanocyte stem cells.
link |
01:16:55.560
You do not have to worry about an ice bath
link |
01:16:57.440
or hard exercise or breathing,
link |
01:16:59.000
increasing your levels of stress
link |
01:17:00.480
to the point where it's going to make you go gray.
link |
01:17:01.900
We're talking again about chronic stress.
link |
01:17:04.820
And if you want to offset the stress effects
link |
01:17:08.520
on graying of hair,
link |
01:17:11.880
you can do that by either having a practice
link |
01:17:15.000
that helps you regulate stress on a consistent basis,
link |
01:17:18.000
so something like non-sleep deep rest or meditation.
link |
01:17:21.120
If you can get access to massages or vacations,
link |
01:17:23.700
those are great,
link |
01:17:24.540
but having a practice to keep stress clamped
link |
01:17:27.280
so that it's not chronically elevated, that will be great.
link |
01:17:31.000
As well, this is another case where sunlight,
link |
01:17:34.000
we know, stimulates melanocytes,
link |
01:17:36.740
not just in skin, but in hair.
link |
01:17:39.080
And so getting ample sunlight,
link |
01:17:40.920
having a practice to regulate stress
link |
01:17:43.260
will offset the stress-induced graying of hairs
link |
01:17:48.080
by way of stress-induced depletion of melanocytes.
link |
01:17:53.240
And if melanocyte sounds a lot like melanin, you're right.
link |
01:17:55.720
That's because anything involved with pigmentation
link |
01:17:57.640
in the brain and body generally has melano
link |
01:18:01.320
in the front of the word in some way or another.
link |
01:18:03.920
So if chronic stress is so bad
link |
01:18:05.640
because of its effects on epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:18:09.280
being elevated for too long,
link |
01:18:11.780
then the question becomes, of course,
link |
01:18:13.800
well, what's chronic stress?
link |
01:18:15.960
How do I know the difference
link |
01:18:16.800
between chronic and acute stress?
link |
01:18:18.880
And how do I keep chronic stress at bay
link |
01:18:22.440
because of all these negative effects?
link |
01:18:23.760
And I didn't even list out the number of other ones,
link |
01:18:25.760
the effects on depression,
link |
01:18:27.800
which certainly has a correlate with elevated cortisol.
link |
01:18:33.400
Thyroid hormone, low thyroid hormone
link |
01:18:36.440
is associated with depression, mistimed thyroid.
link |
01:18:40.200
Once again, getting your light and your feeding
link |
01:18:45.240
and your exercise and your sleep on a consistent schedule
link |
01:18:50.220
or consistent-ish is going to be the most powerful thing
link |
01:18:53.520
you can do in order to buffer yourself
link |
01:18:55.860
against negative effects on mental health
link |
01:18:58.760
and physical health for that matter.
link |
01:19:01.200
There are things that one can take,
link |
01:19:03.920
supplements, prescription drugs, et cetera.
link |
01:19:06.320
Some of you out there may have
link |
01:19:08.080
or may know people that have Cushing's,
link |
01:19:09.560
which is chronically elevated cortisol.
link |
01:19:11.160
There are prescription drugs that we will talk about
link |
01:19:13.280
that can be used.
link |
01:19:14.960
But most people are dealing with a situation
link |
01:19:16.960
where life gets stressful, then less stressful,
link |
01:19:20.040
stressful, then less stressful.
link |
01:19:21.300
I would say based on the data from McEwen and others,
link |
01:19:26.400
Bob Sapolsky's lab over many years,
link |
01:19:28.800
I would say any stress that lasts more than a day
link |
01:19:33.120
or two days or three days
link |
01:19:34.400
is starting to become chronic stress.
link |
01:19:37.200
There's really no strict cutoff
link |
01:19:38.640
because we're not measuring everybody's cortisol
link |
01:19:40.740
from moment to moment.
link |
01:19:41.580
My lab has done experiments
link |
01:19:42.960
where we measure stress in people over time.
link |
01:19:45.040
People vary tremendously in their ability
link |
01:19:47.040
to have a really hard day and then fall deeply asleep.
link |
01:19:49.480
That's going to be the ultimate reset
link |
01:19:51.520
is the ability to sleep well,
link |
01:19:53.540
more or less undisturbed each night,
link |
01:19:55.120
although one or two wake-ups during the night,
link |
01:19:56.960
probably not going to be too detrimental
link |
01:19:58.960
provided they're not too long
link |
01:20:00.640
and you're not viewing light
link |
01:20:02.200
during those wake-ups or your phone.
link |
01:20:04.280
But the things that you can take
link |
01:20:06.020
if you feel like you're chronically stressed
link |
01:20:07.680
and you're veering toward
link |
01:20:08.800
some of the negative effects of stress are many.
link |
01:20:12.380
There are some simple things that people can do
link |
01:20:16.520
in terms of supplementation.
link |
01:20:18.640
All supplements of course have to be checked out
link |
01:20:21.280
for their safety margins for you
link |
01:20:22.960
because it's going to differ from person to person.
link |
01:20:24.640
You're responsible for making sure they're safe for you
link |
01:20:27.320
if you decide to use them.
link |
01:20:28.680
One of the most common ones is ashwagandha
link |
01:20:32.480
and it has a powerful anxiolytic anxiety effect.
link |
01:20:37.100
You're welcome to go to examine.com and for zero cost,
link |
01:20:40.760
you can see their so-called human effect matrix.
link |
01:20:43.880
Ashwagandha has many uses.
link |
01:20:46.080
It's been used to enhance power output in athletes.
link |
01:20:50.860
It has been shown to modestly increase testosterone.
link |
01:20:54.700
It has been shown to modestly adjust things
link |
01:20:56.920
like low-density lipoprotein cholesterol,
link |
01:20:59.080
the so-called bad cholesterol in quotes.
link |
01:21:01.820
It has a profound effect on anxiety.
link |
01:21:03.820
That's been shown in nine studies,
link |
01:21:05.440
nine peer-reviewed independent studies,
link |
01:21:07.280
I mean funded by organizations
link |
01:21:10.240
that have no vested interest in the answer.
link |
01:21:12.980
It has a very strong effect on cortisol itself.
link |
01:21:17.080
How strong?
link |
01:21:17.940
The decrease in cortisol noted in humans
link |
01:21:20.040
is 14.5 to 27.9% reduction
link |
01:21:24.400
in otherwise healthy but stressed humans.
link |
01:21:27.800
That's great, six studies.
link |
01:21:29.560
So that's, and it mentions this is significantly larger
link |
01:21:32.440
than many other supplements.
link |
01:21:33.780
Now, some people will say that taking ashwagandha
link |
01:21:37.080
chronically may not be good.
link |
01:21:39.280
If you've heard about that
link |
01:21:40.560
or you can point to specific studies
link |
01:21:43.480
that indicate exactly why it's not good,
link |
01:21:46.200
please put it in the comment section or let me know.
link |
01:21:49.240
In the comment section on YouTube would be best.
link |
01:21:52.220
The studies that I'm referring to did explore both genders.
link |
01:21:56.640
The number of subjects was reasonably high, 64 or more.
link |
01:22:00.440
One to six months studies,
link |
01:22:02.400
so these were long-term studies, that's great.
link |
01:22:04.160
You'd like to see that, not just an acute study.
link |
01:22:07.020
So males and females, lots of different ages,
link |
01:22:10.960
a weight, excuse me, overweight and non-overweight.
link |
01:22:14.520
They did blood draws of cortisol,
link |
01:22:16.160
which is going to end as well as saliva tests.
link |
01:22:18.240
Saliva is actually the best way to measure free cortisol.
link |
01:22:21.360
You can also measure it from earwax, it turns out,
link |
01:22:23.300
which sounds pretty gross and kind of is,
link |
01:22:26.540
but nonetheless, that's where cortisol will accumulate
link |
01:22:29.320
in earwax and in saliva, the free cortisol.
link |
01:22:32.960
But that's six very quality studies,
link |
01:22:36.600
independently supported that all point
link |
01:22:40.240
to these very significant 14.5 to 27.9% reductions
link |
01:22:44.660
in otherwise healthy adults.
link |
01:22:45.840
So if you're somebody who is dealing with chronic stress,
link |
01:22:48.000
it's a stressful period in your life
link |
01:22:49.680
and you want to stave off the negative effects of stress,
link |
01:22:53.580
well, then ashwagandha may,
link |
01:22:56.080
I want to highlight may be right for you.
link |
01:22:57.680
It also does tend to lower total cortisol,
link |
01:23:00.180
which is interesting, can lower depression
link |
01:23:03.400
to a somewhat minimal degree.
link |
01:23:06.500
And can lower, as I mentioned before,
link |
01:23:08.200
things like low-density lipoprotein.
link |
01:23:10.440
So that, I think ashwagandha comes through
link |
01:23:13.340
as kind of the heavy hitter in this department.
link |
01:23:17.380
Now what's interesting also is the other effects
link |
01:23:19.840
of ashwagandha that are downstream
link |
01:23:22.080
of reducing chronic stress and cortisol,
link |
01:23:23.920
because cortisol has so many effects.
link |
01:23:25.360
There are receptors for cortisol
link |
01:23:26.960
all over the body and brain.
link |
01:23:28.480
And so I'll just list these off quickly.
link |
01:23:30.480
I'm not going to list off each study
link |
01:23:31.980
or talk about how many subjects in detail.
link |
01:23:33.820
Again, you can go to examine.com if you want
link |
01:23:36.020
and just put in ashwagandha.
link |
01:23:37.480
C-reactive protein, which is a marker
link |
01:23:40.120
of all sorts of negative health effects.
link |
01:23:45.040
Cardiovascular health, even macular degeneration
link |
01:23:47.900
is notably reduced.
link |
01:23:49.720
Heart palpitations, notably reduced.
link |
01:23:52.140
Serum T3 and T4, our old friends for the thyroid hormones
link |
01:23:55.380
from a previous episode are increased.
link |
01:23:58.300
Symptoms of OCD decreased,
link |
01:24:00.800
both the obsessions and the compulsions, right?
link |
01:24:03.480
Obsessions are of the mind, compulsions are of behavior.
link |
01:24:06.800
So there are a lot of things that are downstream
link |
01:24:09.900
of reducing cortisol.
link |
01:24:13.240
Lowered heart rate, lowered rates of insomnia,
link |
01:24:16.180
slightly improved memory.
link |
01:24:18.120
Why that would be, I don't know,
link |
01:24:19.400
because cortisol in the short term can increase memory.
link |
01:24:21.680
I'm guessing it's from increased sleep,
link |
01:24:23.920
decreased pain, increased quality,
link |
01:24:27.000
decreased reaction times, things of that sort.
link |
01:24:29.040
So the list goes on and on,
link |
01:24:30.560
but all of those things stem downstream of decreased cortisol
link |
01:24:34.600
So if one were to decide to take ashwagandha
link |
01:24:37.200
in order to reduce cortisol,
link |
01:24:39.160
given that you want cortisol early in the day
link |
01:24:41.280
to have energy throughout the day,
link |
01:24:43.400
the time to take it is probably later in the day
link |
01:24:45.660
or in the evening.
link |
01:24:46.960
I've never heard of it preventing sleep
link |
01:24:48.900
or causing insomnia of any kind.
link |
01:24:51.200
That certainly wasn't listed as one of the major effects
link |
01:24:53.920
on examine.com.
link |
01:24:55.540
I will take ashwagandha from time to time
link |
01:24:57.440
if I'm chronically stressed
link |
01:24:58.560
or if I'm not sleeping as well as I ought to.
link |
01:25:01.160
You might think that with all my knowledge about sleep
link |
01:25:03.120
and sleep protocols
link |
01:25:03.960
that I would sleep perfectly every night,
link |
01:25:05.320
but unfortunately I have a dog
link |
01:25:06.840
that has a canine form of sundowners, of dementia.
link |
01:25:11.160
So he's up much of the night these days.
link |
01:25:13.520
And so there's no way I'm getting
link |
01:25:15.120
a solid night of sleep lately.
link |
01:25:17.120
And so I will supplement with ashwagandha
link |
01:25:19.320
and typically I'll take it before sleep
link |
01:25:21.000
and maybe also with my last meal of the day,
link |
01:25:23.640
which is at least two hours before I go to sleep.
link |
01:25:26.720
Again, you have to decide if it's right for you.
link |
01:25:29.320
The dosages can vary tremendously.
link |
01:25:31.960
I would just go by what's on the bottle
link |
01:25:34.520
from a reputable brand.
link |
01:25:35.640
I would also check out examine.com
link |
01:25:37.600
because it mentions a range of dosages that people have used
link |
01:25:41.180
and in various studies to different effects.
link |
01:25:44.000
Now, there is something out there
link |
01:25:45.480
that some of you may actually be taking or ingesting
link |
01:25:47.680
that can increase cortisol
link |
01:25:49.800
and not so incidentally can decrease estrogen
link |
01:25:53.180
and testosterone.
link |
01:25:54.020
Because remember cortisol is made from the cholesterol
link |
01:25:57.040
molecule, so is estrogen and testosterone.
link |
01:26:00.260
So our estrogen and testosterone, excuse me.
link |
01:26:02.880
And it's competitive.
link |
01:26:05.560
So you're either making more cortisol
link |
01:26:07.400
or you're making more of the sex steroid hormones,
link |
01:26:10.160
estrogen and testosterone.
link |
01:26:12.700
Believe it or not licorice,
link |
01:26:14.560
which I always thought of as a candy,
link |
01:26:16.200
but licorice contains a substance that I can't pronounce.
link |
01:26:21.000
G-L-Y-C-Y-R-R-H-I-Z-I-N glycyrrhizin,
link |
01:26:27.600
which is of the glabrous species of plant.
link |
01:26:32.760
Actually, because of its chemistry,
link |
01:26:35.640
this 18 beta hydroxyceridic acid,
link |
01:26:39.200
you don't need to know all that licorice, black licorice,
link |
01:26:41.960
contains a substance that increases cortisol.
link |
01:26:45.960
And its increase is not huge, but is significant.
link |
01:26:50.020
This has been looked at in females age 18 to 29,
link |
01:26:54.720
males and females age 18 to 29, people age 30.
link |
01:26:58.880
These are separate studies
link |
01:26:59.880
where I'm listing off the different ages, ages 30 to 64.
link |
01:27:03.280
It turns out that you can see pretty substantial increases
link |
01:27:06.680
in serum cortisol and decreases in testosterone and estrogen.
link |
01:27:13.120
So that was complete news to me.
link |
01:27:14.460
Also increases in blood pressure that are pretty substantial
link |
01:27:17.400
that's going to be downstream of cortisol,
link |
01:27:19.780
increasing cortisol is increased blood pressure
link |
01:27:21.780
in order to engage the stress response
link |
01:27:24.360
as part of this stress response.
link |
01:27:25.900
Increased hormones of other kinds
link |
01:27:28.640
that are associated with stress.
link |
01:27:29.740
So who knew?
link |
01:27:30.740
I didn't know, maybe you knew previously.
link |
01:27:33.040
If you did, forgive me,
link |
01:27:33.880
but licorice and some of the compounds in black licorice
link |
01:27:36.240
can actually increase stress,
link |
01:27:37.600
probably not the thing to be ingesting
link |
01:27:40.120
during periods of chronic stress.
link |
01:27:42.320
Whether or not anyone has had positive effects
link |
01:27:44.820
of using it to increase cortisol in other contexts,
link |
01:27:47.560
let me know.
link |
01:27:48.480
But very interesting that the chemistry of licorice
link |
01:27:51.600
increases stress hormones,
link |
01:27:53.760
and therefore you would probably want to,
link |
01:27:56.220
almost certainly would want to avoid it
link |
01:27:58.380
in conditions of chronic stress.
link |
01:28:00.520
Also, if you're trying to optimize testosterone and estrogen,
link |
01:28:02.840
licorice seems like a bad idea.
link |
01:28:05.240
I suppose one instance where you might want to use licorice
link |
01:28:07.800
would be if you're traveling
link |
01:28:08.920
and you're trying to wake up at a particular location
link |
01:28:13.420
because licorice has these effects on cortisol
link |
01:28:15.720
and cortisol is associated with the waking phenomenon
link |
01:28:19.480
and alertness and energy,
link |
01:28:21.080
you could use it in that regard.
link |
01:28:23.640
However, I would be careful to time it
link |
01:28:25.520
so that you're not getting two cortisol increases
link |
01:28:27.600
throughout the day, two peaks.
link |
01:28:29.360
So you're going to want to make sure
link |
01:28:30.840
that you're doing all the other things correct for jet lag
link |
01:28:34.280
and adjusting to jet lag.
link |
01:28:35.760
And if you want to know what those things are,
link |
01:28:37.720
including timing your feeding,
link |
01:28:39.200
using temperature, using exercise,
link |
01:28:41.440
using light to adjust to jet lag more quickly,
link |
01:28:43.920
please see the episode that we did on jet lag and shift work
link |
01:28:46.980
where I cover all those protocols in detail.
link |
01:28:49.340
The other compound that I think deserves attention
link |
01:28:52.200
is apigenin, A-P-I-G-E-N-I-N, apigenin,
link |
01:28:57.000
which is what's found in chamomile.
link |
01:29:01.260
Apigenin, I've talked about previously,
link |
01:29:03.720
it has various effects.
link |
01:29:05.140
One is it is a mild anti-estrogen
link |
01:29:08.560
that's been shown in various studies,
link |
01:29:10.240
and it does have a bit of an anxiolytic effect
link |
01:29:12.780
of reducing anxiety.
link |
01:29:14.300
I take it before bedtime, 50 milligrams.
link |
01:29:17.120
Again, you have to decide or figure out
link |
01:29:19.200
if that's safe for you or not.
link |
01:29:20.340
I'm not suggesting you take it.
link |
01:29:22.160
The major source of action is to calm the nervous system,
link |
01:29:26.400
and it does that primarily by adjusting things like GABA
link |
01:29:29.920
and chloride channels, but also has a mild effect
link |
01:29:32.000
in reducing cortisol.
link |
01:29:33.680
So ashwagandha and apigenin together sort of,
link |
01:29:37.320
I would consider the most potent commercial compounds
link |
01:29:41.880
that are in supplement non-prescription form
link |
01:29:44.280
that one could use if they were interested
link |
01:29:46.960
in reducing chronic stress, especially late in the day
link |
01:29:50.080
by way of reducing cortisol late in the day.
link |
01:29:52.880
So you're probably getting the impression
link |
01:29:54.240
that cortisol and epinephrine
link |
01:29:55.640
are a bit of a double-edged sword.
link |
01:29:57.160
You want them elevated, but not for too long or too much.
link |
01:30:00.220
You don't want them up for days and days and days,
link |
01:30:03.840
but you do want to have a practice
link |
01:30:05.940
in order to increase them in the short term.
link |
01:30:08.920
So we should talk about protocols
link |
01:30:12.580
that can set a foundation of cortisol and epinephrine
link |
01:30:17.760
that is headed towards optimal.
link |
01:30:19.680
Optimization is always going to be a series
link |
01:30:22.080
of regular practices that you do every day.
link |
01:30:24.080
So sleeping at certain times, light at specific times,
link |
01:30:26.760
food at specific times, certain foods, et cetera.
link |
01:30:28.780
And that's highly individual, but there are some universals,
link |
01:30:31.080
and we've covered a number of those in the discussion today.
link |
01:30:34.680
Meal timing, meal schedules has a profound effect
link |
01:30:39.000
on energy levels.
link |
01:30:40.920
And as I mentioned before,
link |
01:30:42.080
the energy I'm referring to is not glucose energy.
link |
01:30:45.740
It's not burning carbs while running or ketones.
link |
01:30:48.600
What I'm talking about is neural energy,
link |
01:30:50.360
epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
01:30:53.080
Fasting and timing one's eating
link |
01:30:55.920
are two sides of the same coin.
link |
01:30:57.840
So even if you're on a kind of standard three meal a day
link |
01:31:00.880
with a couple of snacks in between diet or nutrition regimen,
link |
01:31:04.720
you are fasting whenever you're asleep
link |
01:31:06.400
or you're not ingesting any calories.
link |
01:31:08.000
So unless you're hooked up to an IV of glucose,
link |
01:31:10.160
you are fasting while you're sleeping.
link |
01:31:12.080
There are several different kinds of fasting
link |
01:31:14.060
that can relate to epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
01:31:16.260
I will do an entire episode on optimizing food intake
link |
01:31:20.080
for performance in the sports context.
link |
01:31:23.580
That's coming up, but in the meantime,
link |
01:31:26.600
I'd like to just talk about fasting
link |
01:31:28.640
as a source of epinephrine.
link |
01:31:31.960
Anytime when our blood glucose is low,
link |
01:31:33.960
cortisol and epinephrine are going to go up.
link |
01:31:36.220
If we fast for too long, that is stress.
link |
01:31:39.720
There's no way around that.
link |
01:31:40.640
Now that doesn't mean it doesn't have
link |
01:31:42.080
other beneficial effects.
link |
01:31:44.560
Running a marathon is stress,
link |
01:31:46.320
but it can also have positive effects if that's your thing.
link |
01:31:49.800
So stress has been demonized as a term,
link |
01:31:52.840
but we want to think about stress mechanistically
link |
01:31:55.720
as epinephrine and cortisol.
link |
01:31:57.240
And then if we do that,
link |
01:31:58.800
we can think about how to regulate its timing.
link |
01:32:01.420
So anytime we haven't eaten for four to six hours,
link |
01:32:05.040
levels of epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:32:06.420
are going to go up pretty substantially.
link |
01:32:08.480
There's an exception to that,
link |
01:32:09.680
which is if you are used to eating on the clock
link |
01:32:12.560
every two hours or every hour,
link |
01:32:14.640
being half hour late or being even 10 minutes late
link |
01:32:17.560
on that schedule will induce stress.
link |
01:32:19.180
Most of that is psychological stress,
link |
01:32:20.720
but also the release of things like ghrelin
link |
01:32:22.320
that are going to make you hungry
link |
01:32:23.240
because they're on that eating clock.
link |
01:32:25.340
So one thing that many people do to great benefit
link |
01:32:30.100
is they follow a so-called circadian eating schedule.
link |
01:32:33.480
They eat only when the sun is up,
link |
01:32:35.640
they stop when the sun is down, more or less.
link |
01:32:39.460
The other way to think about this
link |
01:32:40.480
is they stop eating a couple hours before sleep
link |
01:32:42.680
and they eat more or less upon waking,
link |
01:32:44.420
assuming that they're waking up more or less
link |
01:32:46.720
around the time that the sun rises,
link |
01:32:48.720
maybe plus or minus two hours.
link |
01:32:50.440
Okay, so sort of typical schedule.
link |
01:32:52.800
Now let's say you decide to do
link |
01:32:55.200
what I do, which is I skip breakfast.
link |
01:32:56.920
I drink water, I delay my caffeine
link |
01:32:58.680
for 90 minutes to two hours, and then I drink my caffeine.
link |
01:33:01.440
And then my first meal is typically around lunchtime,
link |
01:33:04.080
11, 30, or 12.
link |
01:33:05.200
And yes, occasionally I throw back some almonds
link |
01:33:07.840
or walnuts or something earlier in the day.
link |
01:33:09.560
I do do that from time to time if I get hungry enough
link |
01:33:14.520
or if I just happen to see them.
link |
01:33:15.860
I'm kind of a drive-by eater.
link |
01:33:17.300
If I see blueberries or nuts or something,
link |
01:33:19.080
I just kind of pick them up and put them in my mouth.
link |
01:33:21.040
I try and not do that off other people's plates,
link |
01:33:23.360
but I just have that habit of doing that from time to time.
link |
01:33:26.320
But typically I don't eat until about noon.
link |
01:33:29.160
So I've got a cortisol increase.
link |
01:33:30.880
I've got my sunlight in the morning.
link |
01:33:32.160
So I'm getting a big pulse in energy early in the day.
link |
01:33:34.960
And yes, there's a little bit of agitation.
link |
01:33:36.400
I am hungry sometimes early in the day, sometimes no,
link |
01:33:39.360
but my ghrelin system is used to kicking in
link |
01:33:42.200
right around noon.
link |
01:33:44.020
At the point where I eat,
link |
01:33:45.440
as long as I don't eat carbohydrate, in my case,
link |
01:33:49.140
I know that my epinephrine levels
link |
01:33:50.600
are going to stay pretty high.
link |
01:33:51.760
So for me, it's usually meat and salad
link |
01:33:54.240
or something of that sort or fish and salad.
link |
01:33:56.680
I don't particularly like eating fish because of the taste,
link |
01:34:00.900
but I'm essentially low carb or keto-ish throughout the day.
link |
01:34:03.760
So I'm probably in a slightly elevated state
link |
01:34:07.320
of epinephrine and cortisol throughout the day.
link |
01:34:09.480
Some of you are fasting even longer.
link |
01:34:11.020
You're pushing out till 4 p.m. or 8 p.m.
link |
01:34:13.120
or maybe you're even fasting around the clock.
link |
01:34:15.500
Anytime you're fasting,
link |
01:34:16.860
you're increasing epinephrine and cortisol release.
link |
01:34:19.880
You can do all the meditation in the world
link |
01:34:21.700
to keep your mind calm,
link |
01:34:23.180
but you are closer to that edge of stress
link |
01:34:26.440
and you're closer to that edge of peak stress.
link |
01:34:29.500
So that's something that's just important to understand.
link |
01:34:32.440
The description about comfort foods and cortisol
link |
01:34:34.600
was one of kind of an extreme case
link |
01:34:37.020
where cortisol systems kick over to a positive feedback loop
link |
01:34:40.120
but we all eat to suppress cortisol and epinephrine.
link |
01:34:44.160
When we're hungry,
link |
01:34:45.100
cortisol and epinephrine create an agitation
link |
01:34:46.960
so we go seek food.
link |
01:34:48.320
When we ingest food that typically,
link |
01:34:50.900
if it includes carbohydrate,
link |
01:34:52.000
there's a blunting of cortisol,
link |
01:34:53.320
there's a blunting of epinephrine in the bloodstream.
link |
01:34:55.220
If you've ever had too much coffee to drink
link |
01:34:57.280
and you go and have a couple of pieces of bread,
link |
01:34:59.400
you will feel that you might describe it
link |
01:35:02.320
as the caffeine getting soaked up out of your system
link |
01:35:04.480
but what you're doing is you're elevating blood glucose,
link |
01:35:06.680
which is more or less saturating
link |
01:35:09.280
the effect of caffeine in your system.
link |
01:35:10.820
Not completely, but it's going to have that effect.
link |
01:35:14.520
If you're very stressed and you sit down to eat something,
link |
01:35:16.440
it will calm you down.
link |
01:35:18.020
Yes, because some of the blood that goes to your stomach
link |
01:35:20.040
but more so because of these effects
link |
01:35:21.440
in blunting cortisol and epinephrine.
link |
01:35:23.280
So the important point here is that if you want to be alert,
link |
01:35:27.180
you can do that by way of not eating.
link |
01:35:30.200
Of course, please ingest fluids.
link |
01:35:31.880
I know some people water fast out there.
link |
01:35:33.760
I am yet to see good science on water fasting
link |
01:35:36.380
and why that can stimulate stem cells
link |
01:35:38.060
or people love the idea of after the Nobel Prize
link |
01:35:40.900
was given for autophagy and this idea
link |
01:35:42.880
that our cells clean up debris and senescent cells.
link |
01:35:45.320
Yes, that's true but the idea that water fasting
link |
01:35:48.720
is going to promote that I find rather amusing.
link |
01:35:50.820
Please send me the data if you know some great study
link |
01:35:53.080
in a decent journal but pretty much this is something
link |
01:35:55.480
I hear about.
link |
01:35:56.320
I don't think water fasting is a good idea
link |
01:35:58.660
nor should you be drinking so much water
link |
01:36:00.880
that you kill yourself.
link |
01:36:01.720
You can actually drink enough water that you die.
link |
01:36:04.900
So I think ingesting water in healthy amounts
link |
01:36:07.480
is a good thing, stay hydrated
link |
01:36:08.920
but if you want to be alert, stay hydrated.
link |
01:36:12.080
Caffeine may or may not be in your regimen
link |
01:36:14.280
but fasting will make sure that your levels of energy
link |
01:36:18.720
are up and you will be primed very well
link |
01:36:21.800
for doing a protocol of the sort that we talked about
link |
01:36:24.440
earlier in this episode of breathing or cold exposure
link |
01:36:27.360
or exercise to get that increase
link |
01:36:29.460
in the immune system function.
link |
01:36:31.040
And if you do that after learning,
link |
01:36:32.900
after trying to learn something,
link |
01:36:34.440
it will increase learning
link |
01:36:35.680
for that particular set of information,
link |
01:36:38.480
whether or not it's motor or language
link |
01:36:39.920
or whatever it happens to be, mathematics, programming.
link |
01:36:43.440
So fasting is a tool for many reasons,
link |
01:36:47.720
can increase growth hormone, et cetera.
link |
01:36:49.720
But today I'm talking about fasting as a tool
link |
01:36:52.520
to bias your system toward more epinephrine
link |
01:36:55.920
adrenaline release and toward more cortisol release
link |
01:36:58.560
but still low enough that it's not chronic stress,
link |
01:37:01.880
that it's not causing negative health effects.
link |
01:37:04.160
But please know that if life is very, very stressful,
link |
01:37:08.320
if you're experiencing lots of stressors
link |
01:37:10.980
and you're chronically fasting,
link |
01:37:13.480
you are positioning yourself toward a greater likelihood
link |
01:37:17.240
of being chronically stressed in the ways that are negative,
link |
01:37:20.800
negative effects on the reproductive axis,
link |
01:37:22.520
lower testosterone and estrogen,
link |
01:37:23.880
negative effects on your hair will turn gray.
link |
01:37:27.400
There's reasons for that.
link |
01:37:28.600
Your sleep will suffer, your immune system will suffer.
link |
01:37:31.840
So I think while it's nuanced,
link |
01:37:35.940
our discussion today about epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:37:39.820
increasing energy and immunity are designed
link |
01:37:44.040
to help you understand
link |
01:37:46.560
when you should be doing certain things,
link |
01:37:48.220
when you should throttle back,
link |
01:37:49.680
when you might want to kick up your adrenaline a bit.
link |
01:37:52.160
If you're suffering from low energy
link |
01:37:54.320
because you're just kind of feeling down
link |
01:37:56.600
and a little bit under-activated,
link |
01:37:58.900
well, then the practices of ice baths
link |
01:38:00.840
and intense breathing, et cetera, could be very beneficial.
link |
01:38:03.740
So might fasting.
link |
01:38:05.900
But if you're feeling exhausted and burnt out,
link |
01:38:10.020
so drained and stressed,
link |
01:38:11.960
well, then fasting or doing a lot of cold exposure
link |
01:38:16.140
or doing a lot of intense exercise
link |
01:38:17.880
is driving you further and further into chronic stress.
link |
01:38:20.940
So because I don't have a saliva test or a blood test
link |
01:38:24.860
or God forbid an earwax test to measure your cortisol
link |
01:38:27.520
as we're engaging in this discussion together,
link |
01:38:30.860
you have to gauge for yourself
link |
01:38:33.420
whether or not you are in a state of under-activated
link |
01:38:36.740
and need more epinephrine and cortisol
link |
01:38:40.140
or whether or not you are over-activated
link |
01:38:43.620
in terms of cortisol and epinephrine
link |
01:38:45.140
and you need ways to buffer those, ashwagandha.
link |
01:38:48.300
Maybe it should be a warm mellow bath, not an ice bath.
link |
01:38:51.100
So one has to learn how to regulate these hormones
link |
01:38:53.920
with behavior, with nutrition, perhaps with supplementation.
link |
01:38:56.940
And then of course there are prescription drugs.
link |
01:38:58.740
And I always leave these to the end
link |
01:39:01.100
because A, I'm not a medical doctor,
link |
01:39:02.820
I'm not prescribing anything, I'm a professor,
link |
01:39:04.780
I'm professing a number of things
link |
01:39:05.940
that you can decide for yourselves what to do with or not.
link |
01:39:09.500
But of course there are prescription drugs
link |
01:39:11.820
that can increase cortisol or decrease cortisol
link |
01:39:15.120
in cases like Cushing syndrome,
link |
01:39:16.700
which if you have that diagnosed,
link |
01:39:18.980
you should talk to a physician.
link |
01:39:20.660
You should talk ideally to a endocrinologist
link |
01:39:23.580
but to a physician of some sort, board certified physician.
link |
01:39:27.720
There are drugs that can be used to treat injury
link |
01:39:31.780
like corticosterones that you can inject
link |
01:39:33.700
to reduce inflammation and injury, but they are cortisol.
link |
01:39:36.660
So they're going to bias you
link |
01:39:37.660
towards more stress in other domains.
link |
01:39:39.460
Remember cortisol can cross the blood-brain barrier
link |
01:39:41.940
so you're going to be more prone to psychological stress.
link |
01:39:44.420
I also want to mention again
link |
01:39:45.780
that I think there's great benefit to having a practice
link |
01:39:48.040
that perhaps you do every other day,
link |
01:39:49.340
but if you can't maybe every third day or every other day
link |
01:39:53.000
of deliberately increasing your adrenaline in your body
link |
01:39:56.280
while learning to stay calm in the mind
link |
01:39:58.500
so that you learn to separate the brain-body experience.
link |
01:40:01.460
We hear so much about how beneficial it is
link |
01:40:04.100
to unify the brain and body,
link |
01:40:05.660
that we're all out of touch with our brain and bodies.
link |
01:40:07.580
I particularly dislike claims like that
link |
01:40:11.660
or statements like that because there's great power,
link |
01:40:14.980
as we learned today, in having your body activated
link |
01:40:18.500
by some sort of stimulus, cold water
link |
01:40:21.060
or even psychological stress,
link |
01:40:22.780
but learning to stay calm in your mind.
link |
01:40:24.980
I should just remind you
link |
01:40:25.900
that most of the negative effects on your life
link |
01:40:29.220
and on the lives of others
link |
01:40:30.800
are due to people, perhaps you, I hope not,
link |
01:40:35.000
being unable to regulate their mind
link |
01:40:36.860
when they have high levels of adrenaline in their body,
link |
01:40:39.020
either because they read something in a text
link |
01:40:40.620
or a comment section.
link |
01:40:42.180
Of course, that never happens to me,
link |
01:40:44.020
but it may happen to you.
link |
01:40:46.260
Of course, it happens to me,
link |
01:40:47.780
but the idea is to stay calm in your mind
link |
01:40:49.940
so that then you can regulate your action, right?
link |
01:40:52.460
And so I think that there are these practices
link |
01:40:55.100
that one can develop over time
link |
01:40:57.360
that are really straightforward and zero cost, right?
link |
01:41:01.220
You could find any number of ways
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01:41:03.320
to increase your adrenaline and stay calm.
link |
01:41:06.080
And we tend to focus on things like exercise
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01:41:09.000
as the way that we get our energy up.
link |
01:41:10.740
But today, again, I'm talking
link |
01:41:12.440
about deliberately increasing adrenaline
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01:41:15.160
while staying calm mentally,
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01:41:17.380
because that has great utility
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01:41:18.920
when the adrenaline hits through unwanted events,
link |
01:41:23.900
through things that we didn't seek out.
link |
01:41:25.940
So the ability to regulate adrenaline and cortisol
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01:41:29.980
is about inducing them deliberately
link |
01:41:32.580
when you want to push back on infection,
link |
01:41:35.220
potential infection from bacteria or viruses.
link |
01:41:37.860
It's about pulling back on adrenaline and cortisol,
link |
01:41:40.800
maybe through the use of supplementation,
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01:41:42.400
but certainly through proper use of light and sleep
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01:41:45.700
and mental tools that we talked about as well,
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01:41:48.160
when they are chronically elevated.
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01:41:50.820
It's about training your system,
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01:41:52.720
not just to be unified at brain and body,
link |
01:41:54.900
which sounds great until you're stressed,
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01:41:57.080
and then that's terrible.
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01:41:58.240
It's really about having a deliberate dissociation
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01:42:01.360
between the adrenaline response from the adrenals
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01:42:03.880
and the adrenaline response from the brainstem.
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01:42:06.600
So once again, we've covered a ton of material.
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01:42:10.320
I hope right now you're thinking,
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01:42:12.660
okay, am I in a state of chronic stress?
link |
01:42:15.260
Am I under-activated or could I afford
link |
01:42:17.280
to increase my levels of adrenaline and cortisol
link |
01:42:20.160
to improve my relationship to my immune system
link |
01:42:23.120
and to energy, neural energy?
link |
01:42:26.080
If you like the information that you heard today
link |
01:42:29.400
and you want to remember it,
link |
01:42:30.760
well then at the end of this episode,
link |
01:42:33.540
perhaps you go do something
link |
01:42:34.600
to increase your level of adrenaline.
link |
01:42:36.880
And now you know what some of those things are
link |
01:42:38.200
because it will help you retain the information,
link |
01:42:40.020
or you could apply that to anything else
link |
01:42:41.440
that you learn or experience, of course.
link |
01:42:44.020
And I hope that you'll think about some of the ways
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01:42:47.460
in which cortisol and adrenaline are not good or bad,
link |
01:42:51.840
that stress isn't good or bad,
link |
01:42:53.040
but short-term stress is healthy.
link |
01:42:54.880
Alertness and energy is healthy
link |
01:42:56.320
even if it puts you at the edge of agitation.
link |
01:42:58.780
That's an opportunity to learn
link |
01:43:00.360
how to control these hormones better.
link |
01:43:02.300
And I hope that if you're in a state of chronic stress
link |
01:43:04.480
that you'll do things to start tamping down
link |
01:43:07.040
some of that stress and that you realize
link |
01:43:09.860
that your nervous system and your hormone system are linked,
link |
01:43:13.040
but they're linked in ways that you can control,
link |
01:43:14.900
that we don't have to be slaves to our hormones
link |
01:43:17.120
and certainly not the hormones that cause us stress.
link |
01:43:19.380
We can learn to control those
link |
01:43:20.780
both to the benefit of our body and benefit of mind.
link |
01:43:24.280
If you're learning from this podcast
link |
01:43:25.900
and you like the information that you're learning,
link |
01:43:28.280
please subscribe on YouTube.
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01:43:30.320
That really helps us.
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01:43:31.560
And in addition, if you could hit the notification button,
link |
01:43:34.740
that will let you know when we release new episodes.
link |
01:43:37.060
Now we release them every Monday morning,
link |
01:43:39.560
but in addition to that,
link |
01:43:40.840
we are starting to release short clips now and again,
link |
01:43:43.180
as well as some special content.
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01:43:44.680
So hit the subscribe button please
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If you haven't already subscribed on Apple and or Spotify,
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01:43:52.400
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01:43:53.820
You can certainly subscribe to all three if you like.
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01:43:55.840
And on Apple, you can give us a five-star review
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01:43:58.840
as well as leave us a review.
link |
01:44:01.000
On YouTube is the place to leave us comments and feedback
link |
01:44:04.440
as well as suggestions for future episodes.
link |
01:44:06.740
We do read all the comments
link |
01:44:08.480
and I know many of you are anxiously awaiting
link |
01:44:10.760
particular topics and episodes
link |
01:44:13.000
and we will eventually get to them all.
link |
01:44:14.800
I'm not going anywhere.
link |
01:44:16.360
And we do want to be thorough about every topic.
link |
01:44:19.140
Today, we rounded out the discussion about hormones.
link |
01:44:22.880
We aren't going to continue with that topic any longer.
link |
01:44:25.040
We are moving to a new topic segment
link |
01:44:27.180
for an entire month or so.
link |
01:44:29.320
If you know of other people that you think could benefit
link |
01:44:31.520
from the information on this podcast
link |
01:44:33.420
or that you think would enjoy listening to it,
link |
01:44:35.660
please forward it along to them.
link |
01:44:37.240
We'd really appreciate that.
link |
01:44:39.000
Another great way to support us
link |
01:44:40.440
is to check out our sponsors
link |
01:44:42.040
that we mentioned at the beginning of the podcast.
link |
01:44:44.760
We also have a Patreon.
link |
01:44:46.360
It's patreon.com slash Andrew Huberman.
link |
01:44:49.340
There you can support the podcast
link |
01:44:50.920
at any level that you like.
link |
01:44:53.000
I should mention that I will be answering some questions
link |
01:44:56.320
that come up frequently in the comment section on YouTube
link |
01:44:59.740
in Instagram lives every once in a while.
link |
01:45:02.280
I am on Twitter at Huberman Lab.
link |
01:45:04.320
I'm on Instagram also at Huberman Lab
link |
01:45:06.840
and on Instagram from time to time coming up,
link |
01:45:09.680
I'm going to be discussing answers to your common questions
link |
01:45:13.600
in these Instagram lives
link |
01:45:14.960
and I will make sure that they're recorded.
link |
01:45:16.960
So you can check those out.
link |
01:45:18.160
Please follow our Instagram
link |
01:45:19.440
if you are not already doing that
link |
01:45:21.240
and check out our Twitter if you're on Twitter.
link |
01:45:23.560
I covered a lot of different types of tools today,
link |
01:45:25.520
behavioral tools, et cetera, but I did mention supplements.
link |
01:45:28.860
For those of you that are interested in supplements,
link |
01:45:30.960
we've partnered with Thorne, T-H-O-R-N-E
link |
01:45:34.440
because we believe them to have the highest levels
link |
01:45:36.740
of stringency and quality in terms of supplement production,
link |
01:45:40.360
in terms of amounts of supplements
link |
01:45:41.900
in their different formulations, et cetera.
link |
01:45:44.900
If you want to check out the supplements that I take
link |
01:45:47.660
and you want to get a discount on Thorne supplements,
link |
01:45:50.160
you can go to Thorne, T-H-O-R-N-E.com
link |
01:45:53.640
slash the letter U slash Huberman
link |
01:45:56.640
and you can get 20% off any of the supplements that I take
link |
01:46:00.220
or any of the supplements that Thorne sells for that matter.
link |
01:46:03.800
That's Thorne.com slash U slash Huberman
link |
01:46:07.200
to get 20% off anything that Thorne makes.
link |
01:46:09.920
Thank you for joining me for what I hope
link |
01:46:12.000
was an informative discussion and an actionable discussion
link |
01:46:15.880
about how to increase energy and the immune system
link |
01:46:18.440
by way of cortisol and adrenaline epinephrine.
link |
01:46:22.600
I really appreciate your willingness to learn new topics
link |
01:46:25.920
as well as to embrace and think about new tools
link |
01:46:28.240
and whether or not they're right for you.
link |
01:46:30.120
And as always, thank you for your interest in science.
link |
01:46:33.000
I'll see you next time.